Fines for misuse of water
Fines for misuse of water
MISUSE of drinking water will be punishable with a fine ranging from QR1,000 to QR10,000 in accordance with a law issued by HH the Emir Sheikh Hamad bin Khalifa al-Thani yesterday.
Using drinking water for washing vehicles or for cleaning of open areas in front of buildings are among the violations that would attract the fines under Law No 28 of 2008 which consists of seven articles.
Article 2 of the law contains directives to the Electricity and Water Corporation (Kahramaa) that include, among other things, “the need to ensure good quality and effective performance of all technical components of machinery related to the supply of water and electricity to public and private buildings”.
The owners of buildings or tenants who fail to take measures to check the leakage of water shall be liable to pay fines as per Article 4 of the law.
Those who do not switch off exterior lights in their buildings from 7am to 4pm shall be fined QR500. However, Article 7 of the law provides for out-of-court settlement in the event of litigation pertaining to the offences mentioned in Article 4.
Law enforcement officers from Kahramaa are permitted to check any premises if necessary and take punitive action according to Article 5 of the law.
Washing of vehicles shall henceforth be permissible only at designated places such as car wash and service stations.
I don't know exactly but they are originally from there but lived here and had been for a while. over a dispute either all or most from that tribe were sent back, whether that dispute has been settled now and thwy have been admitted back i have no Idea.I had a friend here at work who was part of that clan and I understand that he went to saudi at the time the dispute took place and heamong others were not accepted back.That was some time ago.
The reason I knew what happened was when i did did not see him around at work and enquired where he went to.
Do you know which clan was sent to Saudi?
Now although some are claiming this is targetting mainly the locals who do not pay for water and electricity, Most of these locals have their cars and court yards washed by their maids and drivers very early in the morning.at the time of morning prayers.Who will come to inspect at that time. The water flows at that time I witness it myself when I go to mosque.
Although some say also that Nationals themselves will be inspectors, there are some here who come from really powerful and influential clans and i don't see a qatari of a lower clan coming and applying the law on a lower clan. Alt5hough there are no casts in islam but arabs had clans and tribes and many are more influential and powerful than others.
Recently over some sort of a dispute a clan that has it roots in Saudi arabia but lived here were all sent back to saudi and not given the right back here.
This just won't work.
sarcastic.
AbuAmerican said "Why institute fines at all? Make EVERYONE pay for it and charge MORE to use it."
That is exactly why misuse is fined so that poor, careful people don't have to pay more.
Look at it from another angle; Income Tax is levied in rates which increase as the income goes up. Why not a flat rate for everyone? Because the rich won't pay enough and the poor will be heavily burdened.
Same principal applies in this case.
"I am going to be careful how I use that product because I have to pay for it!"
In that case there is no fine. Case closed :)
The fine kicks in if there is abuse regardless of one's ability to pay.
Hold on a second... You guys are talking like this is an outrageous thing the Qatar Gov is doing... During water shortages in the US they impose regulations on wasting water which are enforced by.... what?? whats that?? ... could it be?? FINES!!!
If you are a careful consumer then you should be applauding the Government for this incentive.
Water is not a consumer product, it is a commodity. You cannot even compare it with a pair of trainers and such.
"Diplomacy is the art of saying 'Nice doggie' until you can find a rock - Will Rogers"
Then stop letting people buy cars for a carwash!
"Everything in this book may be wrong." Illusions: The Adventures of The Reluctant Messiah by Richard Bach
what you are saying is fine.... You pay QR 30 to use QR 30 of water, QR 1000 for QR 1000 of water... I agree! However, there is abuse and abuse should not be allowed no matter how willing we are to pay for it.
BUT, a reality based mechanism must exist. The laws are not a reasonable mechanism for all the points I stated. Fines outside such a mechanism only become a joke and get nowhere. It does not deal with reality and, as with all non-reality based mechanisms, some poor person making a mistake at the wrong time and place suffer the consequences while constant abusers get away with it.
Metering everyone, charging a reasonable rate for reasonable use and charging an exorbitant rate for abuse brings the hurt to any and all abusers ONLY. With some leniency (such as you abused once in the past 4 years because of a busted water pump and have not since so we let you off), it can actually be effective.
Let's get real for a minute.... "I" have to want to change and these laws do nothing to "me". If I don't pay for water / electricity and have a maid/houseboy, guess who is
- washing the house, car and the neighbourhood at 2 am or as soon as the "water police" are off work
- opening the drain covers on the property and squeegy-ing all the water into the drains.
- A whole host of other "cheats" that we can all come up with.
All in all, a common error is not looking at the whole picture. In this case the picture is a whole lot more that just "there is abuse" and "let's fine abuse".
Just because some are getting away with wasting resources, does not mean that others should do the same.
AbuAmerican said "If I leave the water on all day I am going to get a big bill for it, if a local leaves the water outside running all day who gets the bill?"
Near the Kentucky R/A beside Pizza Inn
"Diplomacy is the art of saying 'Nice doggie' until you can find a rock - Will Rogers"
none of us is pure as driven snow but we don't lose the larger objectives because of our smaller weaknesses :)
The world is not black and white dude. It's mostly Grey.
MD said "If any of you would be really 'serious' you would ride a bicycle instead of a car."
People with deep pockets, consume more than their fair share. This causes prices to go up and commodities to become scarce causing distress and sometimes harm to poor folks.
And yes, we should address this to the Americans, Europeans as well as to Qataris. We are all in the same boat; living on the planet earth.
Your desire to consume what you paid for is called conspicuous consumption and it's a big no-no :)
Where is the car wash in Khairatityat?
travel, so be it.
You use 3 cubic meter, it's free. (You can do with it what you want)
You use 3 to 5 cubic meter it'll cost you QR 400 per month (you can do with it what you want)
You use 5 and more cubic meter it'll cost you QR 1.000 per month (You can do with it what you want)
and so on, and so on.
Desalination and electricity production are very environmental unfriendly. Any attempt to curb the production of any environmental unfriendly industry should be applauded!
With that said ----
Fines! really?! the target are Qatari's? well how does that make any sense?
- Fines are a "when you are caught" policy
- Qatari's afford much larger villas that the average expats with a lot more land insides the walls than expats. Much, much easier to "hide" water abuse.
- there are 4 expats for every Qatari so policing such a law will probably turn up 4 expat culprits for every Qatari culprit despite the stats that say Qatari's use 4 to 5 times as much water as expats.
- Qatari's have "advantages" (deservingly so - this is their country and our income is thanks to them) not available to expats. Thus among the people caught it is more likely that expats will be the ones paying.
if Qatar wanted to make a difference then there would be laws like -
ALL buildings have to have meters
ALL residents (local and expat) must pay for utilities
ALL current buildings without meters need to be converted within 3 years or fined in the 100+K range per month afterwards.
At that point a fine is actually workable. Something many do not know (because it is unlikely you have EVER used this much water) Karhama already have a tiered billing. I learnt this when my water pump broke while I was away for 2 days. Once you cross a certain amount of usage you pay higher rates. They can easily intorduce another tier. Once you cross the 3rd tier 10000 QR automatically.
Osman, that is too academic. Amoud wants to 'protect' an environment that doesn't exist. Qatar is a semi-arid country and ground water is rare. It has an abundance of energy which the government exploits as much and as quickly as possible to fill their pockets. They have a problem to follow up with water production (Desalinization) because they didn't think that thousands of laborers would also need water. With a fine they are trying to hide their planning incompetence. They also encourage people to use motor vehicles with a low fuel price (Don't forget the agent for Mercedes is NBK Al Thani). He won't be happy if people buy Kia only. The same problematic is the immigration law. They cannot provide for families and therefore thousands of Asian workers have to leave their families at home. Planning incompetence again. Let me say it once again clearly: the fine on water misuse is a bancrupcy declaration of the Qatari government. The United Nations call this "low expertise" governments in the Gulf in their latest reports.
Osman, it wasnt about forgetting. The current infrastructure cannot support the growing number of people coming to Qatar.
Dunno know about you but I prefer to not have sewage leaking out of pipes because they cannot handle the capacity.
"Diplomacy is the art of saying 'Nice doggie' until you can find a rock - Will Rogers"
Again you are going to extremes MD. The car thing is comparable to the flushing the toilet theory you had earlier.
A car is a neccessity in more ways than one. Choosing what you drive is the key if you are eco-friendly.
Perhaps I should start growing hemp and make you a nice sweater...
Hi Alexa darling, how are you this evening?
"Diplomacy is the art of saying 'Nice doggie' until you can find a rock - Will Rogers"
If any of you would be really 'serious' you would ride a bicycle instead of a car. How does that sound to your "green" ears!
No, I am not bored, Alexa. But I want to do what I want to do with the things I bought and paid for. That's all!
This is |Qatar Living" is it not?
"Diplomacy is the art of saying 'Nice doggie' until you can find a rock - Will Rogers"
Oh, that's what you mean, Amoud. Then I think we should address 300 million Americans, 400 million Europeans, 1000 million Indians, and 1300 million Chinese first, instead of quarreling with 0.0015 billion Qatar residents.
Perhaps MD, if you wold prefer that you children and childrens have no clean air to breathe, water to drink or food to eat due to lack of productive soil.
This is the bigger picture...
"Diplomacy is the art of saying 'Nice doggie' until you can find a rock - Will Rogers"
Yeah, I miss the big picture. I sell cars but I don't allow you to drive them. I produce water but I don't allow you to use it for your purpose. I build Malls but I don't allow bachelors to use them, and so on. I guess I am too small minded.
Missing the bigger picture MD.
As for electricity in Qatar, they use the surplus to desalinize water, which CAN be stored. They also sell the surplus to neigboring countries in the even they are below their demand.
The implementation of these fines is to raise awareness MD to try and get its residents to be more conservative to make the country more ecologically friendly. If they were just after money they would not impose fines, they would be telling us all to wash our cars a hundred times a day... leave all your lights on...
"Diplomacy is the art of saying 'Nice doggie' until you can find a rock - Will Rogers"
Good points, but electricity, for example, cannot be stored! It has to be used or it is wasted. It requires careful planning to judge the demand. But careful planning probably is not one of the strong virtues of Qatari companies. For the water: why the hell can't I use the water I 'bought' for whatever I want to use it? If I buy anything else I can do what I want with it. If I buy 10 kilo of tomatoes and let them rot, I have the right to do it. If I buy water and use it for the toilet or the garden or for cooking, isn't it up to me after I paid for it?
MD thats a bit contorted isnt it? Qatar is making advancements at getting out of the "third world country" stigma. Water shortages and blackout surely arent the answer. People feel it where it hurts most, their pockets.
Like suing tabacco companies cause you got cancer, or MacDonalds because you are fat. Half the problem with the world today is that people cant take responsibility for themselves... why is this no different?
As for the water and electricity being produced, they are producing to try and keep up with demand. If the resources are produced why do we have to use them all up at once? I dont spend all my salary as soon as I get it just cause it is there....
"Diplomacy is the art of saying 'Nice doggie' until you can find a rock - Will Rogers"
The fine is still stupid. The water and electricity are already produced. They go in the market and are sold. (More or less). What would make a difference would be if the 'production' would be limited. It is the producer who exploits the natural resources, not the user. If the government really were concerned about the resources they would simply reduce the production. Then people would have power black outs and water rationing. Then they might notice that what they use is rare. Why shouldn't I buy the dead chicken if it is in the shelf? It's already dead, but I didn't kill it. Stop killing chicken and people will notice that there is a shortage.
Hmm, I dont think it is about the money MD. It has more to do with the massive strain on natural resources. Most of the water we use here is desalinized, which is a massive energy drain. Hardly fair to impose such a fine on the locals and not expats, to which I may add not all conserve water and electricity, some are even bigger abusers than non-paying locals (some get their water and electricity paid so they also dont care).
One of the Qatari posters also pointed out that this was a step in ontroducing water and electricty tariffs to locals.
"Diplomacy is the art of saying 'Nice doggie' until you can find a rock - Will Rogers"
The 'fine' is stupid. It should be applied to locals only. Every drop of water I use is paid for!
Maybe due to the fact that flushing a toilet is not a luxury, unless you wanna go in a bucket and fertilize your plants.
"Diplomacy is the art of saying 'Nice doggie' until you can find a rock - Will Rogers"
I am sure you are right, Amoud. Expatriates pay, so they will be more careful anyway. But even if they would wash their car, they'd pay for this water, too. So, why should they not be allowed to do that? They are allowed to flush the toilets with 'drinking water'.
MD, I think this is aimed more towards locals than anything. As they do not pay for water and electricity they dont feel the impact of running water all day long outside the house, washing all of their cars every morning... that kind of thing.
They published the statistics a few years back on the average monthly expenditure of water and electricity in Qatar among the ex-pats and the locals.... I really need to dig this up. Around 5 years ago a small qatari household comsumed more than QR 4000 monthly in water and electricity, whereas "palaces" (not sure of the definition) consumed around QR 10,000.
"Diplomacy is the art of saying 'Nice doggie' until you can find a rock - Will Rogers"
I think people s*it more often than they wash their cars. So, they should start fining people who use drinking water to flush their toilets. What a waste!
There is an awesome car wash in Kharatiyat... been here more than a decade and nothing compares to this place.
"Diplomacy is the art of saying 'Nice doggie' until you can find a rock - Will Rogers"
actually regarding carwash est. i really dont care if i have to pay 25qr every wash. whats pissing me off is the bad quality of their service. those guys seems to be always in a hurry, leaving my car almost half cleaned. so i'd rather have a bucket or two and clean my car by myself. by the way i would like to applaude the TEYSEER service station at salwa for giving my car the best carwash ever. but its really hard going there considering the distance from my home. i only go there before my technical inspection : )
actually concerning carwashes related the artilce,to this effect a friend of mine mentioned that the carwashes have to pay a tax of about 10000 riyals.So most car washes have resorted to automatic carwash.So it ia a no no to jet washes.
Plagarism Witch? Seriously?
"Diplomacy is the art of saying 'Nice doggie' until you can find a rock - Will Rogers"
please post the source of this or a website substantiating this? not that i dont believe it, it just would be nice to spread this fine bit of info with some sort of reference or else its PLAGIARISM!!!
"And think not you can direct the course of love, for love, if it finds you worthy, directs your course" -Khalil Gibran
The fines are a part of electricity & water conservation recommendation, which was raised to the Supreme council of ministries. The purpose of the fines is preliminary measure to introduced Qataris to electricity & water fees in the upcoming years. As some of you are aware, Qataris don’t pay residential electricity & water bills yet
I have plants on the terrace - I use the evaporated water from the air conditioners to, not only wash the terrace but, water the plants.
I collect enough evaporated water to do this numerous times!!!
Happy to provide water for car washes :D
What's the problem? Bring your cars round - I have buckets and buckets full of water being wasted! QR20 a bucket? I'm in business :D
Definition of Article 7000
Section a:
All residents in Doha will collect their urine in plastic bottles, turn it in for recycling and it would be use it for human consumption, washing of their cars and watering of the gardens.
Section B:
All Baby stain diapers will be collected and recycle, then the feces it will be use for car waxing.
“Be fearful when others are greedy, and be greedy when others are fearful,”
khoty dy puter passy wetten de banny
Probably because its too dark to tell the difference.. Great idea ... Do you still talk to them ??
lol... Alexa THAT I can do as it involves killing the green growies. It is the keeping them alive part I can seem to master. I have zero foilage in my house ( I detest the ever so popular plastic greenery here)
"Diplomacy is the art of saying 'Nice doggie' until you can find a rock - Will Rogers"
Literally "CSI" !!!! A green haven where you can pluck fresh produce right from the vine... careful Alexa, if I came you may never get me to go back home lol.
Completely hijacking here.... where is DaRude these days.
"Diplomacy is the art of saying 'Nice doggie' until you can find a rock - Will Rogers"
Ahhh, now I am really envious.
I would love to have a garden full of veg and herbs, flowers etc but the sad thing is I have a bit of a black thumb. I even killed the asparagus ferns and the aloe plants.
"Diplomacy is the art of saying 'Nice doggie' until you can find a rock - Will Rogers"
they should fine foul smelling people for not bathing.
Alexa this should also be fine... if they gave you a hard time about it I am sure you can explain. Again I think it all comes down to being discreet.
BTW, how lucky are you to have your own patch of grass here in Qatar *turning "green" with envy*
"Diplomacy is the art of saying 'Nice doggie' until you can find a rock - Will Rogers"
in theory i think this is brilliant
in practice...whooooooaaaaaaaaa nightmare...nearest car wash for me is Al Wabb petrol station and it is always packed full - just no chance to take the car for washing sometimes -
ok up by the Airport
Alexa I think you can, but you have to be careful not to make a huge puddle outside your house.
"Diplomacy is the art of saying 'Nice doggie' until you can find a rock - Will Rogers"
Agreed 100% Tallg. We occasionally washed our own cars but not often. I was so glad to hear this law was coming out. Our neigbors had water running all day letting their kids play in the hose outside their house, which made the front of my house a muddy mess.
I think that locals will be fined also, they arent exempt from the law, and most of the guys checking the water and elec meters now are locals. Remember kids, water and electricity are free for locals, they are only recently becoming aware of the strain it puts on their natural resources.
I do think it is a shame that they are now imposing a fee on those water taps outside thier houses though. The people that use these taps really rely on them.
"Diplomacy is the art of saying 'Nice doggie' until you can find a rock - Will Rogers"
oirog - this isn't about money making, it's about saving resources. Qatar has a problem with shortage of water and power. If you don't start conserving it now your bills will go up in the future, so it's money saving more than money making.
They should probably think about turning out all the lights in those unoccupied office tower blocks in West Bay and along the Corniche.
your'e right, water is essential. Bravo
simply, another money making scheme. our world is simply going small here. nevertheless i think we have no choice but to follow. i am willing to spend 25qr a week than to risk that hefty fine.
you mean some of you actually drink from the taps??
As i read the main article it's law number 26 of 2008 and not 28 :)
Really? lol!
That definitely wouldn't be drinking water.
tallg - I am not sure but I know they take the water from the nearby Fire Hose :)
Ban Spoon Feeding not Me
charan - I expect the car parks will come under "designated places". They don't use drinking water.
There will be lot of Jobless people. eg. Car washing Prople in Shopping Centers (eg. City Centre)
Ban Spoon Feeding not Me
well said thejam
-- F L A M M A B L E --
"dgoodrebel will always be the rebellious good one"
Yeah but guess what, who are the ones who actually wash their cars and the front of the houses daily? Expats?
this fine thing is joke isn't it.
If this law is applied above board the Govt can make a lot of money out of fines.However there is no one who will go to the house of a well known and rich national and impose a fine on him.I think the person who does that would be on the next flight home. So it is no point them making these laws when they will apply it only to expats.
Long over due. I hope at least now there wont be swiming pools on the roads.