Islam and sports. A question from non-muslim.

which sounds similar to what you may have thought was a rather 'silly' suggestion about freezers, but if you see my post about how to cook pork, then this again makes some sense as to the reasoning behind this.

"Both the Koran and the Torah have prohibitions against eating the flesh of cloven-hooved animals,i.e., pigs and a few other species you wouldn't think of eating anyhow. Some people say that the pig was viewed as unclean because they eat just about anything, but it's also a good idea for a nomadic people not to eat something that takes a long time to cook to eliminate the trichinosis bacteria that used to be common in pork."

I don't believe they destroy chickens carrying bird flu in China nor diseased beef - they simply cook the affected animal/bird at extremely high temperatures.

I think ...

What Foodborne Organisms Are Associated With Pork?

Pork must be adequately cooked to eliminate disease-causing parasites and bacteria that may be present. Humans may contract trichinosis (caused by the parasite, Trichinella spiralis) by eating undercooked pork. Much progress has been made in reducing trichinosis in grain-fed hogs and human cases have greatly declined since 1950. Today's pork can be enjoyed when cooked to a medium internal temperature of 160 °F or a well-done internal temperature of 170 °F.

Some other foodborne micro-organisms that can be found in pork, as well as other meats and poultry, are Escherichia coli, Salmonella, Staphylococcus aureus and Listeria monocytogenes. They are all destroyed by proper handling and thorough cooking to an internal temperature of 160 °F.

Rinsing Pork

It isn't necessary to wash raw pork before cooking it. Any bacteria which might be present on the surface would be destroyed by cooking.

DISEASES CAUSED BY PORK

The following lists show germs or parasites that are found

in pork and some diseases caused by them. Many of these

diseases are contagious while some are proven fatal.This proves

that the more science advances the more Islam is shown correct

as a religion of God.

PARASITIC DISEASES

a) TRICHINELLA SPIRATIS ( Trichina worms )

It is the most dangerous parasite to man ( Rheumatism and

muscular pain). The infected persons shown no symptoms, recover

very slowly some die, some reduced to permanent invalids. No one

is immune from this disease and there is no cure.

b) TAENIA SOLIUM ( Pork tape worm )

The worm causes malnourishment of the person leading

to anemia, diarrhea, extreme depression melancholia and

digestive disturbances. Cysticercosis means that larva enter

the blood stream then settle down in one or more of the vital

organs of the body, for example: brain, liver, lungs or spinal

cord. They grow and encapsulate, inducing pressure to the

system around, resulting in dangerous diseases (diarrhea,

digestive disorder, anemia, chronic invalidation).

c) ROUND WORMS

Examples: Ascaris, which may lead to digestive

disturbances, appendicitis, obstructive jaundice.

d) HOOK WORMS

Examples:Ancylostomiasis, which may lead to

anemia, oedema, heart failure or retarded

growth ( mental and physical), tuberculosis,

diarrhea and typhoid.

e) SCHITOSOMA JAPONICUM

Bleeding, anemia and other syndromes. If ova

are settled in the brain or spinal cord, paralysis

and death may occur.

f) PARAGOMINES WESTERMAINI

Infestation leading to bleeding of the lungs

( endenve haemoptysis)

g) PACIOLEPSIS BUSKI

Digestive disturbances leading to persistent

diarrhea; generalized oedema.

h) CLONORCHIS SINENSIS

chlonorchiasis-obstructive jaundice, liver enlargement.

i) METASTRONGYLUS APRI

Causes bronchitis, abscess of the lungs.

j) GIGANTHORINCHUS GIGAS

Cause anemia and digestive disorders.

k) BALATITIDIUM COLI

Causes acute dysentery and general weakness.

BACTERIAL DISEASES

1. Tuberculosis

2. Fusiformis necrofurus: causing foot-rot which is very

difficult to heal.

3. Salmonella Cholera suis: causing cholera

4. Paratyphoid

5. Bruceellosis: Acute, sub acute and chronic. It may lead

to permanent disabilities.

6. Swine Erysipelas: causing Erypelas in man.

Viral Diseases

1. Small pox: is was a source of infection to man.

2. Japanese B-encepphalitis: It is the source of infection

3. Influenza, foot mouth disease, gas tro-enteritis of the

new born babies.

Protozoal Diseases : Toxo plasma goundii- It is a very

dangerous diseases.A new born baby of an infected woman may die

within few days or weeks after delivery. But if he survives

he may develop blindness or deafness.In adult chronic exhaustive

fever with enlarged liver and spleen may occur. Pneumonia, or

celebro- spinal meninggitis which may lead to death or madness.

The patient may become blind and deaf too.

"Source: http://www.webziner.com/islam/whypork.htm"

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http://www.showcaseyourmusic.com/LittleGuitarist

"Never interrupt your enemy when he is making a mistake."

Napoleon Bonaparte (1769-1821)

Guys for clarification - In Islam - pig meat has been forbidden. It has been just stated that its filthy and its meat is forbidden. Can get you the exact quote later if any one is interested. But the scientific reason has not been given. However, science and research today has proven now the unique features of a pig that makes it very different from all other animals. As Ram has given in his posting some of the medical reasons - a simple search on the net or a chat with a qualified Doc will get you the reasons.

ARMY

" Life is not a party we hoped for, but while we are here, we might as well dance! "

* The dietary laws of Judaism (Kashrut, adj. Kosher) and Islam (Halal) forbid the eating of flesh of swine or pork in any form, considering the pig to be an unclean animal (see taboo food and drink). Seventh-day Adventists and some other fundamental Christian denominations also consider pork unclean as food. "Source: Wikipedia"

* Muslims' abstention from pork eating is

in adherence to the Qur'anic Law which states:

" Forbidden to you for (food) are: dead meat,

blood and the flesh of the swine and that

which hath been invoked the name other than

Allah. "

Holy Qur'an 5:4

MEDICAL ASPECT OF THE PROHIBITION

Abstention from eating pork is a measure to safeguard

health.Of all the domestic animals, pig is the most

avaricious, eating anything including human excreta. It is the

cradle of harmful germs and parasites. Its meat is carrier of

diseases to man, thus making it unfit for human consumption. *source: http://www.webziner.com/islam/whypork.htm*

and many searches can show u why it was banned ...

================================================

http://www.showcaseyourmusic.com/LittleGuitarist

"Never interrupt your enemy when he is making a mistake."

Napoleon Bonaparte (1769-1821)

Jauntie,

I agree with you to a certain point on these hardliners and am against imposing religion on people. But as you rightly mentioned eventhough at a different context that the coin has two sides. There is a reason why these hard liners are being created. There are many reasons actually and one of them is the continued harrassment, discrimination that these people have to go through. Hence some of them take different approaches, at times the extremist methods to get justice. As I always say - I am not justifying it. But no point in blindly attacking these extremists. We need to take a step back and reflect and try to stop the actual reasons. Like Gandhi said " hate the sin not the sinner". We are all against these extremist approaches but to solve it - lets stop the double standards and these discriminations.

On the school - I am not sure of which state funded school you are referring to and am not aware of the back ground. Hence cant comment on it specifically. But just a question - there are christian and other religious funded schools and colleges all around the world - how come no one is creating a fuss about it ? Does these institutions not create the divide that you mentioned or is it only applicable for muslim institutions? Just a question.. dont want to sound like a radical. Infact I honestly have a high regard for many of the christian missionary schools and colleges for their great standards. But my question here is at a different level - I hope you get my point.

" Life is not a party we hoped for, but while we are here, we might as well dance! "

Pig meats, Alcoholic drinks or wutever makes u high, having sex with a woman which is not ur wife ... Those r the forbidden things that was named .. there are other things which wasn't named but it was generalized that any thing harmful for ur health and wasting ur money is forbidden .. for example: Smoking

rather than that we can or drink any thing .. including seafoods .. non of them were banned yet ..

================================================

http://www.showcaseyourmusic.com/LittleGuitarist

"Never interrupt your enemy when he is making a mistake."

Napoleon Bonaparte (1769-1821)

u r wrong about why the pig is banned in islam its not because its eating s**t n stuff like that its because the way the pig eats not chewing or curding or somehting like that i am not sure

btw for your information did u know that chicken is the dirtiest of all it will eat any thing.

If you can't change your fate, change your attitude.

read my post again .. this is what i meant .. that i'm blaming the muslims who misunderstood the islam and became terrorist by their own choice thinking that they r the right and others r sinful ..

may be i wasn't clear in my post but this is what i meant ..

================================================

http://www.showcaseyourmusic.com/LittleGuitarist

"Never interrupt your enemy when he is making a mistake."

Napoleon Bonaparte (1769-1821)

I know Jews aren't supposed to eat shrimps, lobsters etc because they are deemed to be 'scavengers'. i.e. eat anything off the seabed.

Maybe that's how a pig is viewed too - a scavenger.

Also, Ram

Who misunderstood Islam, not the people who are blaming muslims for being terrorists, but those muslims who chose to be terrorists, in spite of the spirit of Islam.

Ram,

Pigs eat what is given to them. In other words if you feed them rubbish, they will eat it. What about cows which are fed with "vitamins" made of the proper cow bones?

In other words, this is something controllable by human being and a matter of hygiene.

I believe there is also something going on in Holland at the moment where young Muslims are trying to change that "who ..gave them the right to judge and punish people who choosed their way away from islam" idea.

Unfortunately, I think they will be persecuted for trying to do this.

From The Times

September 11, 2007

Young Muslims begin dangerous fight for the right to abandon faith

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/world/europe/article2426314.ece

*sigh*

The problem is the misunderstanding of ISLAM and how to apply it in current life .. which lead to made some of them as terrorists .. and sadly a lot of people are saying "Muslims are Terrorists"

I don't blame them either .. i blame on those who misunderstood the ISLAM and they think wrongly that they understand every thing ..

who the hell gave them the right to judge and punish people who choosed their way away from islam ... who gave them the right to decide who is sinful and who is not .. it's their retarded mind and they think they r brilliant and understand every thing .. while they don't ..

================================================

http://www.showcaseyourmusic.com/LittleGuitarist

"Never interrupt your enemy when he is making a mistake."

Napoleon Bonaparte (1769-1821)

"for example, that the Quran bans pig meat because when it was written no-one owned a freezer! Life moves on." .. no Jauntie .. it wasn't for that reason .. or the other kind of meats would have been banned too ..

the main reason behind that is bcuz Pigs eat rubbish and when he doesn't find food he eat his sh*t .. which is having a lot of harming substances which will be harming to the human being ...

When the Quraan was written it wasn't written for the old days .. it was written for all the muslim generations. so we can't say that we r in 2007 and we r still talking about what woman shud wear .. she shud follow the religion's rules if she want to .. if she choosed not to follow she is already sinful ..

I really believe that following the religion is from the inside of us .. it's up to us to follow it or not ..

================================================

http://www.showcaseyourmusic.com/LittleGuitarist

"Never interrupt your enemy when he is making a mistake."

Napoleon Bonaparte (1769-1821)

and I hear what you are saying but, as you say, the fact remains that we achieve nothing in these discussions because there are hardliners everywhere in this world and, until one or other section of those fundamentalist quit trying to impose their laws on others, there will always be conflict and bad feelings.

I read daily in UK newspapers about how people are finding various matters concerning Islam unacceptable. Today there is an article about State funded schools which are specifically for teaching Muslim children. The big and understandable fear in today's climate is that the schools with breed more discontent in our society and isolate those children and their families, causing ghettos to spring up.

One person commented in a letter to the editor that to fund schools this way was taking us back to the religious segregation days of not so many decades ago which made for so much killing in, say, Northern Ireland.

Children MUST be taught both sides of the coin or, at least, tolerance of others - they are our future, after all.

I don't know what to say, I really don't :o(

Jauntie - yes you are right - no country dont has the right to impose Islam or its teachings on the non muslims. And it is against the VERY basic guidelines of the religion. But you also need to realize that there does not exist a proper Islamic state today - hence one cant take every thing that happens in any of the existing states as a role model.

What we have are Arab countries ruled by Muslims and the rules and regulations dont completely comply with the actual Islamic teachings or values. There are some or many aspects that conform to Islamic teachings and many that dont. But at times - we are not fair in our analysis - example - every one makes a big hue and cry over Saudi imposing the viel over all ladies irrespective of their faith. I am not a fan of Saudi - so dont start bashing me on that! But just putting some food for thought..But when France and certain other European countries BAN women from covering their head - thats fine. Saudi does not claim to be a democratic state - but france does! And how democratic is this. And most importantly - all citizens of Saudi are muslims ( whether they practice it properly or not is another topic!) and there are no non-muslims as citizens over there. Hence most or infact all of their rules are to suit their citizens and the expat community is considered like a traveller who is staying over for a set duration for a purpose. The rules are clear and only those expats who are ok and fine with it need to go in. Others can choose not to go. No one is forcing any one to go to Saudi. Now again - I am not going to debate whether what they do is fair or not! There are two sides to that argument also.. So hold on the horses.. let me complete! But in a country like france where they have citizens who are Muslims - they still dont respect the values or preferences of their very OWN citizens. I am not talking about the expat or tourists in the country, but the genuine citizens. My point is simply that we just choose to see what we want and choose to ignore what we want. We most of the time - are not fair or balanced in our views. If some one wants to criticize Saudi yes - he/ she may do so. I find most of such criticisms with double standards. At the same time - yes there are many areas where these Arabic countries are not fair and need to change - tell me one country in the world where every thing is just perfect! I would love to move over there today! THe fact is that there isnt any.

ARMY.

" Life is not a party we hoped for, but while we are here, we might as well dance! "

is not that I disagree with how a Muslim should or shouldn't behave, but that Muslim governed countries inflict those doctrines on non-Muslims.

"A muslim who chooses to drink alcohol is sinful; a woman who has reached puberty shows her hair, wears tight fitting clothing in public or in front of men she can marry, is sinful; the one who chooses not to fast or pray is sinful.

Anyone who disobeys such rules in Islam is eligible for punishment by the executive authority in this life and Allah in the hereafter."

As far as I know countries who are not governed by Muslim Laws do not expect Muslims to comply with THEIR way of life. It's called 'live and let live'.

I am quite certain, for example, that the Quran bans pig meat because when it was written no-one owned a freezer! Life moves on.

Bajesus,

What PM said is very true. If Islam would have been following Quran only, I would be the first in line to convert, because it is a logical, straightforward and sane faith (aside from the fact that Islam has the same view on Jesus, which I have).

Unfortunately human being cannot live just by the word of God. Humans always need invent something else with a very noble pretext. And with the time passing by this human invention suddenly becomes for many as important as the faith itself. And this makes me very sad (as bbksiu put it).

Yes, you are right Dveller.

I can add just two points more.

First one.

Maryam Yusuf Jamal has the real Bahraini passport with full citizen rights and I think she changed her name because been converted to Islam. It doesn't prevent her from using more open suit than Qatari gymnast Aljazy Al-Habshi.

Second one.

I don't want irritate anyone here by posting a lot of pictures with women athletes from Azerbaijan, Turkey, Kazakhstan, Egypt, Maldives, Uzbekistan, Malaysia, Singapore, Palestine, Indonesia, Algeria, Tunisia, Morocco, Brunei, Bahrain or Pakistan. You can easily make research on the web pages for such kind of sports as:

- Swimming

- Synchronised Swimming

- Diving

- Track and Field

- Water Polo

- Artistic Gymnastics

- Rhythmic Gymnastics

Or just remember what you could see here during Asian Games in Qatar.

PM,

Noone is obliging you to read the understanding which is backed up by Quran and Hadith plus the scholars understanding. By the way muslims are obliged to correct other muslims when it comes to sharia ruels. It has nothing to do with men telling women. I have even told men to cover themselves properly (man is obliged to cover himself from the naval to the knees) and not to imitate women!

I sense you carry some erroneous ideas such as 'personal choice'. If you mean we have free will then this right. Human have been gifted with the faculty called Thinking/Reason/Intellect which distinguishes us from the animals.

However if you mean that as muslims we can interpret sharia rules as we want or choose how we follow them then is is false.

We don't have 'personal choice' to do as we wish. We are obliged to obey God period.

A muslim who chooses to drink alcohol is sinful; a woman who has reached puberty shows her hair, wears tight fitting clothing in public or in front of men she can marry, is sinful; the one who chooses not to fast or pray is sinful.

Anyone who disobeys such rules in Islam is eligible for punishment by the executive authority in this life and Allah in the hereafter.

Thus the concepts called the General Freedoms (Freedom of Ownership, Association, Belief,and Speech) which exist in the west contradict Islam and hence are rejected. I will post a separate discussion on why we reject these concepts using Islam as the yardstick.

The only place where I can see the issue of personal choice within the Sharia rules is those rules called Recommended. Permitted or disliked i.e the actions which fall into these three categories are those actions in which the person has the choice to perform or not to perform and there is no condemnation in this life or hereafter. Examples of such actions include, praying the sunnah prayers (recommended),driving a car (permitted), and getting divorced (disliked).

It is true that there are many hadith upon which disputes have existed or divergent opinions have come into being or on certain matters different understandings exist. This is because of the ambiguous nature of some verses of the Quran upon which differing understandings can be extracted or the manner in which hadith were classified.

However in certain matters there are no differences of opinion such as the necessity of the woman to cover herself, alcohol and pork etc being forbidden, or adultery being forbidden, that a woman has the right to inherit and can spend her earnings in a manner she wishes, that Muslims must ensure that an Islamic state exists and carries Islam to the world etc.

Where there are legitamate differences then we accept the others persons opinion that he/she carries with respect to a particular issue. Of course the pre-condition is that all opinions must be based upon evidence (Quran, Sunnah and their extensions: consensus of the companions and Qiyas (legal reasoning or anology). One selects the opinion he or she feels is the strongest because of the evidence and not because it makes ones life easier!

And God knows best!

Born "Zenebech Tola" in Ethiopia

http://osaka2007.iaaf.org/photo/gallery.html#41461

Foto

WHY NOT LOOK TOWARDS BAHRAIN INSTEAD OF SAUDI ARABIA???

Gold medalist Maryam Yusuf Jamal of Bahrain finishes ahead of Yelena Soboleva of Russia during the 1500m Final. World Athletic Championships in Osaka (Japan-2007)

Even males have a dress code, the problem is they are more interested in enforcing womens dress code than their own.

Why its always every ones problem to talk about Islam and Islamic Values. Yes it is having some thing different. which attract people, which invite people to talk and to think. Why we are not talking about what Chrestianity says, what Hinduism say or what all other religion talk about. Its because there beleivers have practice it upto ther worship places. But all respected members, t is very very clear to know that Islam is giving all rules of life. Every one has his open choice to follow any religion. No one can force to follow Islam Only. But it is till u are not be a muslim. But once u embrace Islam restrictions are there. So every one shall be sure before practing Islam as his/her religion. But after be a muslim we have to follow the rules which are not unhuman. If I am not discussing why there are ladies in bikini or why they are wearing this or that so others should not make it a topic. We being muslim Ladies/Gents have faith that all of us has to pay/get what we will parctice after knowing right or wrong as per Islam.

So feel relax my dear brother and sisters and try to spend your time positvely to creat somthing for the well being of humanity.

Regards

I liked to read it & I don't care if a man or a woman posted it. I liked it and generally agree with what was said. Each to their own I say...

Assalamualikum

PM,

Muhammed (pbuh) said 'The Deen (Islam) is naseeha (advice)' So some advice:

Allah (swt) says in the Quran (to paraphrase)' It is not befitting for a believer to have a say in any matter after Allah and His Messenger have passed judgement" and Muhammed (pbuh)said 'None of you will have true belief until you accept my decisions with full submission and find no resistance in your hearts'

Allah (swt)says, "In the Messenger you will find the best of examples",

"Whatever the Messenger bought take it and whatever he forbad leave it"

"O you who believe, enter into Islam completely and follow not the footsteps of ‘Satan', indeed he is an open enemy for you"

It is clear from the Quran and Sunnah that the believer completely submits to the Sharia and accepts the beliefs and rules without question.

Of course for every matter there must be evidence and we must follow evidence and not follow any scholars because they are scholars but rather we follow scholars because we find the evidences they use credible i.e. we are understand that the evidences the scholar we follow uses the strongest evidence in those matters where a difference of opinion exists on a particular matter.

The issue is not about being on some 'middleway' or being 'extreme' or otherwise, rather the issue is about obedience to the Creator. Obedience can only take place if we follow the sharia rules and the minds role in this is to understand the rules and not to twist them to suit our needs i.e. compromise to fit in!

Anyway here is some evidences for the womens dress code in Islam:

Explicit Mention of Jilbab in Primary Muslim Religious Sources

The authority of the requirement for women to wear the jilbab is the Qur’an itself. In the chapter of al-Ahzab (The Confederates) the following verse instructs Prophet Muhammad:

'O Prophet!

Say to your wives and your daughters and the women of the faithful to draw their jalabib (pl. of jilbab) close around them; that is better that they will be recognized and not annoyed. And God is ever Forgiving, Gentle.’ [2]

The divine wisdom for instructing women to wear the jilbab mentioned in the above verse is so that women be modestly attired and not be subject to the irreverent insults of the unscrupulous.

The obligation of jilbab is also derived from the Sunnah of Muhammad (peace and blessings be upon him) which is the second primary source of law for Muslims.

Narrated Umm Atiyya: We were ordered to bring out our menstruating women and screened women to the religious gatherings and invocation of the Muslims on the two Eid festivals. These menstruating women were to keep away from the musalla. A woman asked, "O Messenger of Allah! What about one who does not have a jilbab?". He said, "Let her borrow the jilbab of her companion".[3]

The above understanding was practised by women at the time of the revelation of the above verse as the following reports indicate:

A report narrated Umm Salama,(A wife of the Prophet): When the verse, "That they should draw their jalabib close around them" was revealed, the women of Ansar (inhabitants of Madinah) came out as if they had crows over their heads by wearing jalabib.[4]

A report narrated by Aisha (Another wife of the Prophet): The wife of Rifa'a al-Qurazi came to Allah's Messenger while I was sitting...and she was showing the fringe of her jilbab.[5]

The Opinion of Reputable Experts in Quranic Exegeses

The classical experts of Quranic exegesis all support the legitimacy of the jilbab with only difference being whether it extends to covering that face. Here are some quotes from the most widely recognised Sunni sources.

Ibn Jarir At-Tabari (d.310[6]):

‘God Almighty said to His Prophet Muhammad (pbuh[7]): Tell your wives, daughters and the wives of the believers…that they should draw over themselves their jilbabs.’

Al-Qurtubi (d.671):

‘Jalabeeb is the plural of jilbab, and it is a garment larger than a khimar (headscarf). It has been narrated by Ibn ‘Abbas and Ibn Masud that it is a ridaa (large sheet of cloth). It is said that it is a qina’/veil but the correct view is that it is a garment which covers the whole body. It has been reported in Sahih Muslim on the authority of Umm ‘Atiyyah who asked; "O Messenger of Allah! What about one who does not have a jilbab?". He said, "Let her borrow the jilbab of her companion".

Fakhr ad-Din ar-Razi (d. 606):

‘In the days of Jahiliyyah (pre-Islamic times) the free and women in bondage would go out uncovered and they would be followed by those intent on fornication and consequently allegations would be levelled against them. So that is why God ordered the free women to wear the jilbab.’[8]

Ibn Kathir (d.774):

‘God Almighty commands His Messenger (Muhammad) to command the believing women – especially his wives and daughters – to draw the jilbab over their persons’[9]

In Safwat at-tafasir, a modern work by Muhammad Ali as-Sabuni, which compiled the exegeses from most of the reputable works of Quranic exegesis, said that verse 59 of chapter Ahzab is saying to the Prophet to ‘tell the women that they should wear a wide outer garment.’[10] This is the consensus view of the traditional Sunni scholars.

This view is not confined only to Sunnis but is the view of the Imami Shia as well:

Al-Janabizi said:

‘The women did not cover their faces and chests with their jilbabs, hence God Almighty ordered them to cover their faces and chest with jilbabs so that they can be distinguished from other women. The woman’s jilbab is a wide garment worn over the normal clothes…’[11]

Views of Contemporary Scholars

The classical position that that the jilbab is obligatory is the view generally held by contemporary scholars as well. Like the classical scholars their difference was on whether the jilbab should cover the face or not and not on the conditions of the jilbab. As an example of the contemporary position the following are words of the deobandi Mufti Ibn Adam al-Kawthari which is representative of the general view: ‘The above and other interpretations of jilbab are clear that a jilbab is the outer garment that women must wear when emerging in front of strangers. This garment must be wide, loose, and modest and covers the body completely.’

Sheikh Muhammad Al-Hanooti:

‘The verse 59 of Surah Al-Ahzab urges a woman to wear a Jilbab. A Jilbab means the outer garment over her inner clothes to guarantee that everything of her body is covered and doesn’t show or shape any of her figures. That is the objective of Shari’a.’

What is a Jilbab?

The jilbab is an outer garment which covers the whole body. This definition is discerned from a lexical and textual basis:

Lexical description of jilbab as an Outer Garment:

The nature and description of the jilbab can be understood from the lexical definition of the word jilbab as explained in classical Arabic dictionaries. These sources also explain the function of the jilbab as an outer garment:

Ibn Manzur:

"The jilbab is the outer garment, mantle, or cloak. It is derived from the verb tajallbaba, which means to clothe. Jilbab is the outer sheet or covering which a woman wraps around her on top of her garments to cover herself from head to toe. It hides her body completely"[12]

Al-Fayruz abadi:

"The jilbab...is that which conceals the clothes like a cover"[13]

As for modern dictionaries it is worth citing from the monumental work of the 19th-century British scholar and lexicographer Edward William Lane (1801-76):

Arabic-English Lexicon: ‘jilbab: …one that envelopes the whole body: (TA) and a wide garment for a woman, less than the milhafah (sheet): or one with which a woman covers over her other garments…’[14]

This description has also been given in the Oxford Dictionary of Islam edited by John L. Esposito where it states:

Jilbab Generic term for women’s outer garment (shawl, cloak, wrap) in Arabian sedentary communities before and after the rise of Islam. The Qur’an (333:59) instructs Muslim women to cloak themselves as a mark of status and as a defensive measure against sexual harassment in public places.[15]

The textual definition as enunciated by the law giver is of jilbab as an outer garment.

The reasons for concluding that the jilbab is an outer garment are textual as well as linguistic. What is meant by textual in this context is the primary corpus of Islamic legal text obligated by the law giver i.e. the Qur’an and the practise of Prophet Muhammad. So for example in chapter 24 the following verse gives elderly women the option to set aside their outer garment:

‘And as for women past child-bearing who do not expect wed-lock, it is no sin on them if they discard their (outer) clothing in such a way as not to show their adornment. But to refrain (i.e. not to discard their outer clothing) is better for them. And Allâh is All-Hearer, All-Knower.’ [24:60]

The garment mentioned must be an outer garment as the verse could not possibly be saying they should discard their normal everyday clothing. That is why companions of Muhammad, such as Ibn ‘Abbas and Ibn Mas’ud, both understood the garment to refer to the jilbab, since that is the outer garment that is worn by women.[16] Both of whom are considered experts in Quran exegesis.

Authority for it as an outer garment is also to be found in the Sunnah. The above report of Umm ‘Atiyyah is clear in its indication that the jilbab is an outer garment. This is because the Prophet stipulated that before going out she needs to wear a jilbab and if she does not have one she must ‘…borrow the jilbab of her companion".[17] The fact that she was not allowed to go outside without it indicates its function as an outer garment.

Also Abu Dawud records a report on the authority of Umm Salama (a wife of the Prophet) which indicates that jilbab is an outer garment. It is reported that she asked the Prophet: "Can a woman pray in a long dress and a headscarf without wearing an izar (a type of jilbab)?" He (pbuh) replied, "If the long dress is ample and covers the surface of her feet." (Abu Dawud[18]) The fact that Umma Salmah asked if she can wear a long dress and headscarf without the izar (jilbab), this indicates that the izar (jilbab) is normally worn on top of the regular clothes.

This is supported by the view of companions who said that the clothing of women during prayer is the above three items, which means the izar (jilbab) must have been worn above the normal clothes. So for example it is narrated that Umar (ra) said: ‘The woman should pray in three items of clothing: long dress, headscarf and izar (jilbab).’ It is also reported that his son Abdullah b. Umar said: ‘The woman should pray wearing long dress, headscarf and milhafa[19] (jilbab).’[20]

It is due to the above narrations that Al-Shirazi took the view that the jilbab is the outer garment as the following excerpt shows: ‘It is recommended that when a woman prays that she wears three items of clothing: a headscarf by which to cover the head and neck. A dress to cover the body and feet and a milhafa (jilbab) by which to cover her clothes. This is due to the report that Umar (ra) said: ‘The woman should pray in three items of clothing: dress, headscarf and izar (jilbab).’ It is also reported that Abdullah b. Umar who said ‘The woman should pray wearing dress, headscarf and milhafah (jilbab).’ Also, it is recommended that her jilbab is thick so that it does not describe parts of her body and does not move away when she assumed the bowing and prostration positions so that it does not describe her clothes.’

An-Nawawi (d.676)[21], a commentator of Al-Shirazi’s Muhazzab explained the latter’s comments and attributed it to Shafi’i (the founder of the Shafi’i school of thought): ‘This ruling has been stated by ash-Shafi’i and the scholars of the school are agreed on this.’ Then he quotes the view that the jilbab: ‘is a sheet worn over the clothes i.e. that it is an outer garment)’ saying: ‘This view is correct and it is the view of ash-Shafi’i (i.e. that the jilbab is worn over the ones clothes).[22]

Ibn Hazm stated in his al-Muhalla: ‘In the Arabic language of the Prophet, jilbab is the outer garment which covers the entire body. A piece of cloth which is too small to cover the entire body could not be called jilbab.’[23]

Thus, the fact that the jilbab is an outer garment is established by the Qur’an and Sunnah and it is the same meaning understood by the companions of Muhammad (pbuh) and attested by the scholars.

Other conditions:

There are other conditions which are not specific to jilbab but generally applicable to all clothing when women go before non-mahrams (close relations to whom marriage is impermissible) whether inside or outside the home. They are the following:

i. It must be loose-fitting

ii. Should not be semi-transparent

iii. Should not become an attraction (tabarruj)

iv. Should not resemble the clothing of men.

These conditions are well known and accepted and there is no need to dwell on them, for further discussion of their evidences one can consult the relevant books of Islamic jurisprudence. [24]

Islam preaches the middle road approach and has never promoted the extremist approach. If the person has read and understood the Quran and Hadith properly - it would be quite obvious. However - if the person has only read parts of Quran or Hadith - they would never understand it. Again - to understand Quran and Hadith, the person must study History and only then can the person completely understand the concepts and the essence. Not just history.. the more a person has exposed himself or herself to science, philosophy.. etc.. the more the person would be able to comprehend the values better. Unfortunately many of the so called experts are illiterate in other spheres of life..like a frog in a well. And a few others who have a read a litte of this and that - jump about claiming that they have read it all and know it all. As they say.. "some times.. a little knowledge can be more dangerous than NO knowledge"

The sad part is that every tom dick and harry wants and is keen on giving their fatwas and their verdicts.. most of them dont come close to the actual teachings.. but they would argue as if they are the scholars! Not pointing fingers to any one in this thread - but I suggest every one who STATES things about religion - to be sure about what they are saying. If you are speaking your mind out - state that and dont mix religion with it.

No - I am not claiming to be a scholar or a mr. know it all! I just could not resist commenting this.. appologies if I have stepped on any ones feet.. not intentional.

" Life is not a party we hoped for, but while we are here, we might as well dance! "

Unfortunately, Islam is used by some for business purposes.

Actualy the term Islamic Cola on those cans or bottles is non-sense.

Guess you know about the meat we eat and labelled "Slaughtered According to Islamic Sharia". Funny thing is to find such labels on Frozen fish packs or canned fish (as if fish can be slaughtered)

but all the other colas here are alcohol free too :S

Is alcohol free:))))))))))))))))

If anyone out there thinks my comments on this thread are 'apologetic', please be assured they are not!!! Hilarious!!!

PM, have you read the latet here?!_______________________________________________________

Love is the answer...

I'm guessing it's just normal cola that's been manufactured in Saudi. There's no such thing as halal and haram cola.

Islamic Cola ? Huh ? How does that work ? :S

food stuff is either halal (allowed) or haram (not allowed)...so im not sure what you mean islamic coca cola?

there are a lot of apologetics on this forum...presenting a form of islam that appeases non muslims...a sufi 'moderate' type of islam whose origin is not Quran or hadith....but the west is very happy with this version...it keeps the muslims docile and declined...

that dress code is totally unislamic..i don't know why some muslims insist in changing islam to suit the west when the quran and hadith are clear...

lets not use logic when it comes to the sharia rules because your logic is not immune from error and contradiction....obey the rules and not twist the rules to suit your whim and desire.

Also how can she be happy and justify disobeying Allah when Allah says he will account all for every atoms weight of good and every atoms weight of bad one does?

what next Islamic pork?

Btw. Aljazy received an 0.3 penalty for incorrect leotard.

I am too :)

I know this is not totally on topic but I had to reply whenI read that :)

Back on topic...yeah I would think she represents the country more so that the country's offical faith, and has chosen to wear kit that is acceptable to the competions regulations and to compete in...for the sport. What she wears on a day to day basis may be completly different.

You might as well discuss how many angels can dance on the head of a pin! Rules (whose rules?) are ment to be broken. The girl competed in what she wore because she wanted to. All of you commenting for or against due to some value judgement, from who knows where! Delusional in the extreme, take a step back and re-read where you're coming from.

I don't go to mythical places with strange men.

-- Douglas Adams, The Long Dark Tea-Time of the Soul.

But you certainly don't see Qatari women/girls, most of them anyway, wearing anything as revealing as that in public because fact of the matter is it IS frowned upon in our society. Personally I try not to care what anyone else wears unless they're stylish at which point I take notice! :-P

My opinion is that it's her right.

People are to concerned with others.

Whatever she does is her choice and her faith is between her and God. Nobody else.

I am behind PM 100%!

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Sorry you got offended PM but my replay was mostly after the thing like "Matter of choice" , "She obviously felt comfortable competing like that" , "Not a big deal. Remember, she's wearing it in a sporting competition, not down the local souq" and i was not directing my replay on you in anyway ..

Im not questioning anyones beleves and my replay was about the easy replays who almost said that it's ok .. yes its ok to do what you want and we all know that Alla will be the juge of what you do in your life , but dont tell others that its like that in islam and encourage it .

and for what the prophet said .. i think this hadeth say it all about the way women's wear now (he didn't force them, he just said that they wont even smell heaven) :-

قال الرسول صلى الله عليه وسلم " صنفان من أهل النار لم أرهما ، قوم معهم سياط كأذناب البقر يضربون بها الناس، ونساء كاسيات عاريات ، مائلات مميلات ، رؤوسهن كأسنمة البخت المائلة ، لا يدخلن الجنة و لا يجدن ريحها ، وإن ريحها يوجد في مسيرة كذا وكذا "

Yes we can't force others to wear that but it's wrong to say its the right thing to do .. anyway .. im not qualified to give you fatwa or tell you whats right and what is wrong about islam as a normal muslim so i ask you to call Al-Awqaf and get books about it and think about the day were we all going to stand and wish we can go back and do the right thing .

good night its time to sleep ^^ .

why don't you just tell him straight, why beat about the bush? :P

gotta love that woman lol

Wonder if you know what you talking about.

Can you tell me what is the dress code in Islam. Many Clerics have different opinions. Some would say that face covering is compulsory, others are not in fovor. What I know for example is that in Lebanon and Syria, face cover was a Turkish tradition and not an Islamic principle. IF you visit all Islamic countries from Malaysia to Morocco, you will find different ways of dresses and Islamic dress codes.

We are learned enough and Islam is clear enough to have us not depending on clerics to advise us on what to wear. Let aside the stock market Islamic advisory council who tell us what shares to buy and what shares to sell. Manipulating the market and having us achieve profit or run into losses.

Then if for example I want to do 69, I have to check with some clerics about it.

And mind you, the way females should dress is to prevent excitement to the males. Don't you think that the male moustache for example would be exciting for the female.

Let us be realistic and reasonable and apply the logic along the Islamic principles and doctrine.

Yes .. this girl is violating the religious rules , im sorry to hear others talking about covering untile the knee and stuff and i dont really get where they got that answer from and make's me wonder about other stuff too ~_~ .. i mean its basic's in islam on what you can wear and how for men and women for over 1400 years ! .

as for "why she is allowed to represent an islamic country" .. its just life my friend .. they dont even put the picutes like this for qatari womens in the newspapers man !! , its like they are ashemed of what they are doing .. so its like in every religion man :) , you can't make them folow it's just free to choose and that's why we all love Qatar ^_^ .

and if you have anything you want to ask about islam please dont ask here .. as you can see not me or them can give you the right answer .. and call "Qatar Center for the Presentation of Islam" AT 486-4966 and they offers beginning spoken Arabic and written Arabic courses free of charge if you are intersted ^^ .. but im not sure if they do it all year .

PM, of course I know Qatar is not Saudi. But not being an arabic speaker (yet) I am not exposed to the details. In order to understand something I have to ask, and this is exactly what I am humbly doing here.

Thank you PM and Diamondgirl for the answers, it was very nice of you to explain this all to a gringo :)

There's your answer, Terramax, Qatar is definitely not Saudi. We are not in the game of forcing every women who walks on the land to wear prescribed clothing.

Al Jazi obviously liked the leotard and Team Qatar supported her.

There is no law about clothing here. There are guidelines for dressing modestly and I guess if you wore a bikini in the Mall it would cause a stir but wouldn't that be the same in any country.

In my own family it crosses the spectrum...some women wear abayas, others jeans and a top, some men wear thobe, some a suit/jeans and a t-shirt. Most like to be traditional in what they wear but not all. It's not the law and they're free to choose.

And don't forget, she's representing Qatar, not Islam, in this sporting event.

I hope my explanation is of some help to you. Feel free to ask/PM me any questions you have about Qatar.

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What about an Omani or Emarati PM. would this have been allowed there??

Wait, wait... I don't judge and I don't really care who wears what. Remember I am neither arab nor Muslim. I am only trying to understand where tradition ends and personal choice begins. I live and work here, I want to understand how the world around me is organized.

The reason I was asking why she is allowed to represent an islamic country is because I can't imagine anyone representing Saudi be dressed like this, given the fact that clothes there is not a matter of personal choice, not even for non-Saudi and non-muslim.

PM, I can always count on you to aticulate MY thoughts in Arabic in English!

Couldn't have said it better...we'll decide what to wear and what to do..I know I have all my life...and i'm a Muslima...shock, horror, sharp intakes of breath all round!!

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She would not be ostracised by anybody. It's really up to her and what she chooses to wear. I guess she believes that in the end she answers to Allah. Some say religious advice on clothing is law, some say guidelines. I think her family/husband have agreed with this choice of outfit, as has the Qatar team she represents. Not a big deal. Remember, she's wearing it in a sporting competition, not down the local souq.

In all religions, the followers practise their belief in lots of different ways. For example, here in Qatar one sees Muslimas completely covered in black...face covered, black gloves on, the lot. Then you see other Muslimas in very figure-hugging outfits and lots of make up. It'a personal choice.

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As far as I know FIG has certain rules with respect to leotards, and some years ago French team was fined for having their leotards too open. Same rules won't allow to use the outfit covering the whole body. Actually this Qatari gymnast does already have a special leotard with "shorts".

The question remains - if she is doing something against islamic rules (and she does), how come she represents an islamic country? Don't you see there a contradiction? Will she be ostracized by let's say her schoolmates for showing her body in the public?

Since religion and tradition are so interwaved in the Middle East I am just trying to understand where the personal preference ends and religious law begins.

Sandra Wilkins, yes, I've met her a few times. Looking forward to those swimsuit designs!

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We have such Islamic friendly swimsuites in Egypt so it is not really something new, as for the question, I don't think that any Muslim, conservative or not, can claim that what she is wearing comply with the rules of Islam...but of course she is free to choose, and abviously she did (by the way my sister wears a bikini, so please don't bombard me with accusations of being retarded bla bla bla)

Good idea, Oryx...i thik there's definitely a gap in the market for ready made modest swimwear here for mixed swimming pools.

Thought here are more Ladies fitness centres opening up with swimming pools. I went to see at the opening of it and the ladies were wearing regular swimming costumes.

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ladies

for a while i have been thinking with Qatar promoting sports why dont VCU or somebody push design in muslim friendly sportswear?

who ever opened a trendy shop selling this i think would make a lot of money.

So excited to hear that! Would love to see some of the designs in the shops here...

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There are Qatarias who choose not to wear abaya and shayla. Who's to say she does? There are also Qatarias who wear swimsuits in public. Matter of choice.

PM, you can get swimsuit material in the souq and have a tailor make up a burkini to your specifications. Think I saw some in Souq Al Dira before the summer.

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Fully covered in loose clothing on a beam would be a straght way to a serious injury. But, how come - two extremes from gymnastic leotard in public to veil covering face and it is all up to the individual? Why no Qatari wear swimsuits on the beach then?

It's really up to the individual...imho, she could have extended the leotard down to the knee and covered her head with the same outfit material to be a little more covered.

Conservative Muslims would probably say that she should be fully covered in loose clothing with head covering.

She obviously felt comfortable competing like that.

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Love is the answer...