Pilot refuses to fly with two..

And the truth comes out. These guys have hired lawyers, are playing victim and are getting ready to cash in

http://www.businessweek.com/ap/financialnews/D9N4QH781.htm

words: STUPID PILOT

A Muslim only airline would lead to all sorts of arguments and fighting at the check-in as passengers and staff debated about who in fact was a "real" or "good" Muslim, just like QL. The airline would never see a single plane take off and would go bankrupt in a week.

How about a secular airline that lets all passengers on and only removes any persons acting suspiciously according to the professional eyes of the staff? Once cleared, the formerly-suspicious person would be placed on the next available flight at the expense of the airline with its apologies for the inconvenience. The formerly-suspicious person would take it all in his stride, realizing that further investigation is not the same as accusation and understanding that such measures are in place to protect him and his fellow passengers and believing in the maxim 'better safe than sorry.' No need to make a media frenzy issue of it, he would say to himself, because after all far worse would be the case when a pilot is afraid to remove a suspicious passenger for fear of bad publicity and that passenger to turn out to be a terrorist.

Having a Muslim only airline would make them no better than the bigots who refused to fly with Muslims..

Legal Pad

enlighten us please who the owners of Qatar Airways, Emirates Airlines and Gulf Air are. I have not seen their Register of Shareholders.

I think Qhris has got a valid point. Muslims passengers on the plane would not create a fuss seeing someone else in Abaya, or with a big long beard. They would accept it.

Otherwise, how do you know Bin Laden is burning in Hell? You seem to know a lot of things, very special things, that the rest of us don't know! Are you a magician?

Qhris said:

why some entrepreneur has not come up with a 'Muslim Only' airline yet.

Explain to the Public?

Who ows Qatar Airlnes?

Who owns Emirates Airlines?

Who owns Gulf air?

Do you actually think, there will be special rules and safety guidelines for muslims only?

Your statement has no firm ground, it is shallow and hollow.

Was it a Pilot, or a Passenger.

Pilot does not have the right to offload the Passenger unless, the Passenger is a Eminent Threat to the Aircraft and the Passengers....

If the Check-in staff issued boarding pass, and Airport Security Cleared the 2 Imams then there seems to be no reason for the Pilot to Offload them

I agree with you Britexpat, but how do you prove the pilot was racist? We weren't on the plane. Maybe a racist passenger told the cabin crew that they were acting suspiciously and talking about bombs. What choice does the pilot have?

Such is the price of traveling in the post-9/11 world. When I was a young student traveling on my own, I accepted that customs would search me every time I went through an airport for drugs. It was annoying, prejudicial, and a hassle, but I fit profile and accepted the inconvenience (and no, I never had drugs).

The version of the article I read indicated the guys were not that fussed, and accepted it. So long as the authorities follow the law and treat them with the required respect, there is not much they can do.

The way things stand, it is all too easy for bigots and racists to take unilateral action without being accountable..

much legal redress to set a precedent though.

It is important that the passengers, who are the eyes and ears in the cabin, DO have a say.

If some law comes in to snuff out ANY feedback then Pilots will be too scared to kick off drunk, threatening etc etc people for fear of the law.

There already too many laws making people indecisive....this was poorly executed, but I still hope a load of red tape doesn't follow this incident.

Pilots in the US have the right to refuse anyone to fly. One women on Southwest Airlines last year was removed because her skirt was too short.

There's no legal redress for cases such as this. They were put on another flight following additional security checks.

Britexpat, as long as there is no legal recourse these cases are bound to happen. I believe you are right. I would have thought there was some kind of Passenger Charter for Delta Airlines. I checked on their website. There was none.

I guess the staff who conveyed the passengers' concerns to the pilot blew it out of proportion or was unable to deal appropriately with the complaining passengers' request. Whichever, it was wrong and unfair IMHO. Poor guys! I hope they get legal redress.

Oh yeah I totally get you, he is an idiot.

Like all organisations they were probably sh*t scared that if something DID happen (however unlikely) the Pilot's family can turn around and say 'he told you so'.

Interesting how non of the other passengers were under suspicion though, whether Muslim or not.

Doesn't this sound like the PERFECT diversion tactic for a bomber? Call the two Muslims on the plane dodgy, therefore diverting attention away from yourself as an unsuspecting white bomber?...

eventhough pilot is the commander of the aircraft, but he should respect the security agencies and ground staff. as they have already cleared those passengers, if there is no security threat to the plane now on what basis he can refuse ?? there should be some basis.

You're right..

A Pilot is indeed the commander, but he should be held accountable for his actions also.

Maybe be right but legally the Pilot is the 'commander' of the plane, in charge of its safety and security and what he says goes.

He will argue that legally anything that happens is his responsibility within the walls of that aircraft....which I am guessing makes for hundreds of pompous Pilots drunk on their own power.

You are absolutely right,

Some papers are saying that a couple of passengers voiced concerns and the Pilot therefore refused to fly with them.

What ever the reason, these types of cases are bound to occur as long as there is no legal recourse.

From what I read there was no justification and (at least in my mind) should not have been permitted. I am not against profiling, but it's beyond the pale to refuse to take passengers because of the way they dress. There are presumably people with legal American residency (if they are not citizens). I agree it was ironic that they were on their way to a conference on religious tolerance.

OK, then the pilot had no justification.

I'd be interested to know how he knew though as the pilot should be locked in the cabin before the passengers board.

Qhris, good point. Whatever you said is correct. The Halal Industry, The Halal Holidays in Cyprus and other parts of Europe. The Islamic Banking & Finance.

Muslims could have Islamic in-flight entertainment instead of Hollywood/Bollywood films and music. They won't be bothered by fellow passengers drinking whisky. Some food for thoughts here Qhris.

Guess what! When the plane arrives, it's gonna be hell for Immigration and Customs Officers, lol.

I can imagine something like, "Hey check it out, Bin Laden people landing at 1400 hrs terminal 5. Bird Sierra Foxtrot 112 on tarmac 5. Go go go." lol.

If there were any passengers that were uncomfortable with the imams, they should have offloaded those passengers instead ;-)

Ironically they were headed for a conference or something on misconceptions about Islam

B2D

Copied and pasted:

Two Muslim leaders have been asked to get off a passenger plane after a pilot refused to fly his aircraft with them on board.

The two men say they that their Delta connection flight from Memphis was about to take off when the pilot decided to turn around.

Masudur Rahman, who is also an instructor of Arabic at the University of Memphis, said by telephone from the terminal at Memphis International Airport that he and another imam had been allowed onto board their flight to Charlotte, North Carolina, before they were asked to de-board.

The aircraft pulled away from the gate, but the pilot then announced the plane must return, Rahman said.

When it did, the imams were asked to go back to the boarding gate where Rahman said they were told the pilot was refusing to accept them because some other passengers could be uncomfortable.

Rahman said Delta officials talked with the pilot for more than half an hour but he still refused.

The men were taken to a lounge and booked on a later flight.

They called the Council on Islamic-American Relations, a Muslim civil rights and advocacy group in Washington, D.C.

'It's racism and bias because of our religion and appearance and because of misinformation about our religion.' Rahman said. 'If they understood Islam, they wouldn't do this.'

He said a Delta manager had apologised for the pilot's actions, but that he and Zaghloul never spoke directly with the pilot.

Transportation Security Administration (TSA) spokesman Jon Allen in Atlanta confirmed the incident but said the agency had not initiated it.

A Delta Airlines spokeswoman said the flight was operated by Atlantic Southeast Airlines, which is also based in Atlanta.

Rahman said he was dressed in traditional Indian clothing and his travelling companion, Mohamed Zaghloul, of the Islamic Association of Greater Memphis, was dressed in Arab garb, including traditional headgear. He said they had both been cleared by security agents and boarded the plane for an 8:40 a.m. departure on Friday.

Ibrahim Hooper, of the Islamic-American organisation, said the said airline officials at Memphis tried to resolve the situation, but the pilot refused. He said his group would follow up with the airline and with the TSA to help ensure such incidents do not continue to occur

My comment: Just because some passengers were uncomfortable does not mean it is a valid reason, does it? If it is, then any one with a long beard and indian traditional dress should take travel insurance against some fellow passengers. I guess I would be gutted if I were one of them two imams and would surely bash one of them grumpy passengers. I don't think this has anything to do with fear. It's more like being thick in the head.

why some entrepreneur has not come up with a 'Muslim Only' airline yet.

There are so many billionaire Muslims and I am sure they get totally annoyed by stories like this of idiot Pilots persecuting their religion for no reason at all.

Just think, you could have little prayer rooms on the plane, serve Halal food....even have a call to prayer at certain time of day.

I guess it would be impossible to have a network stretching to all destinations (meaning Muslims would still have to travel other airlines) but there is such a mass market for Islamic products I am amazed that with so many ignorant stories like this, that some Muslim has not said 'Enough! We will fly ourselves if you don't want us'.

This was posted earlier in the day...got deleted promptly by MODs. Let see, what happens...NOW.

The pilots job is to flythe aeroplane, it's someone elses job to profile passengers. If these passengers were profiled and allowed to board the plane, the pilot should have shut his cockpit door and got on with his work.

Unless there is some sort of a threat to the flight, the pilot has no right to refuse.

ha ha ha ha ha

I read the article,,,, there was no valid reason.

Even the Airline Officials tried with the pilot for half an hour but his only view point was that the other passengers "might be" un-comfortable.I don't consider this as a valid excuse. There were no passenger complaints. Its only the stubbornness of the pilot.

Its shameful.

If he had a valid reason, yes.

Sorry, I can't open the link at work :o(