A Question of Honour?
Up to 17,000 women in Britain are being subjected to "honour" related violence, including murder, every year, according to police chiefs.
And official figures on forced marriages are the tip of the iceberg, says the Association of Chief Police Officers (ACPO).
It warns that the number of girls falling victim to forced marriages, kidnappings, sexual assaults, beatings and even murder by relatives intent on upholding the "honour" of their family is up to 35 times higher than official figures suggest.
The crisis, with children as young as 11 having been sent abroad to be married, has prompted the Foreign and Commonwealth Office to call on British consular staff in Bangladesh, India and Pakistan to take more action to identify and help British citizens believed to be the victims of forced marriages in recent years.
Commander Steve Allen, head of ACPO's honour-based violence unit, says the true toll of people falling victim to brutal ancient customs is "massively unreported" and far worse than is traditionally accepted. "We work on a figure which suggests it is about 500 cases shared between us and the Forced Marriage Unit per year," he said: "If the generally accepted statistic is that a victim will suffer 35 experiences of domestic violence before they report, then I suspect if you multiplied our reporting by 35 times you may be somewhere near where people's experience is at." His disturbing assessment, made to a committee of MPs last week, comes amid a series of gruesome murders and attacks on British women at the hands of their relatives.
Almost all victims of the most extreme crimes are women, killed in half of cases by their own husbands. Sometimes murders are carried out by other male relatives, or even hired killers. The fear that many thousands are left to endure honour violence alone may be supported by the disturbing details of the incidence of suicide within the British Asian community. Women aged 16 to 24 from Pakistani, Indian and Bangladeshi backgrounds are three times more likely to kill themselves than the national average for women of their age.
"If contacted by concerned young British men and women in the UK, the FMU (Forced Marriage Unit) provides free and confidential advice on the potential dangers of being forced into marriage overseas and precautions to take to help avoid this happening," said a Foreign Office spokesperson last night. "If we learn that a British national overseas is being forced into marriage, or has already been forced into marriage, we look at various means of consular assistance ranging from action through the courts to rescue missions."
Full report : http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/a-question-of-honour-police-say-17000-women-are-victims-every-year-780522.html
What kind of warped mentality thinks this is OK? For everyone reading this and tut tutting and sympathising, especially men, please reflect on how you treat the women in your life...do you try to control them, even just a teeny, weeny bit? I believe this is part of the same mindset as the above atrocities against women.
True..nobody has right to 'force'.
The issue is not whether these girls have to option to work or stay at home. This issue is that these girls are being forced to get married when they are as young as 11.
tra la la
Brainwashing and control start from birth in some families. Some are taught that to do anything the family disagrees with would bring enormous shame on the family. Many girls/women feel completely helpless having grown up with this indoctrination.
Some women are never allowed to leave the house without their husband/father/brother. That's imprisonment in my book.
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Love is the answer...
Syam, your wife has an option but not these girls. They are bereft of any self respect. It happens slowly. Starts with a sarcasm and the abuser slowly builds an abusive pattern until he gets violent. (I am sure you treat your wife in a respectful manner. )Abusers are people like you and me. They can be very charming in real life.
Mom_me,
I didn't say it casually to 'take control' . I mean it. Become educated, become financially independent, become a mentor, be in a social team, be aware...
You can find solution only if your know the exact problem.. A general steaming will not lead anywere. My wife left Microsoft corporation and joined me in Doha, to have a flavor of family life. She can think in two ways. one is ' My hubby is a male egoistic,so he can't give up his job, and Ihave to sacrify and join him. .. The second one is ' I want to enjoy every moment of my newly born kind and come back to workforce once I am ready, let hubby take care of me..
She has option to choose.
What really needs to happen is that all men should immediately cease telling women what to do, wear, say, where to go and not go, who to marry, etc.
Obviously this will not happen which is why I created this thread and why I give my time to this issue. It needs others to do the same.
Many dripping taps a river make.
Education, awareness, action.
[img_assist|nid=57389|title=|desc=peace|link=none|align=left|width=|height=0] _______________________________________________________ Love is the answer...
People who think that women are moron to go through such a relationship where they are being abused everyday are putting all the blame of the abuse on the women herself and not the abuser. This thought in itself is passive abuse. No self respecting woman wants to do it, they are trapped. Ask me I have saved an office mate only for her to fall into another such relationship.
syamsat,
maybe we should just lock up all the men, and let the women have control of everything...how would you like that solution??
What kind of fight can an 11 year put up? Where can she go when its her own family putting her in this situation??
tra la la
Syamsat, to start with stop being judgemental about the one who is being killed and throwing a casual 'so take control' and start judging the evil men whose action require to be justified.
its been 2000 years the same problem persisting. You suggest a solution..I am waiting to hear.
Syamsat, if you think that your well meaning and caring 'take the control' word will somehow jerk all the women into reality all of a sudden since they are azzholes uptil now please think again. All these abusers are their husbands/fathers/brothers whom she trusts blindly. If a woman just walks out of something the abuse does not stop neither is she aware what she is into until it happens. As I said you have to be a woman to understand it.
And how would an 11 year girl take control??? Fight her family? How do you suggest she do that??
tra la la
by the way who 'GAVE' the control to him?
take the control..
Her mother was probably in the exact same situation and can do nothing to stop it when her own father is the one controlling everything.
tra la la
Her mother is also woman.. who supposed to blow the vigil? it that not women?
Syamsat, reading does'nt always suffice you have understood the message someone is trying to convey.
Darude, how hard is it for you to love your own kin/family ?
Syamsat,
you think those girls choose to be married off at 11 to someone 20 years older??? And that they are the one stopping their freedom???
tra la la
hmm be nice well if i be nice will the world turn upside down?? will every one be nice?? will every one treat each other nicely. NEVER.
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Mom_me,
I have been through the whole thread..The extract is women 'WANT' freedom. unfortunately if anybody 'GIVES' it is not freedom, it is alms. It is there already, you only have to stop loosing it to others..keep it with you inseparable..react violently if anybody tries to take it from you. The only one who are stopping from freedom is 'YOU'.
Ah Mom, Da is really a softy...dont worry about him otherwise he will have plenty of angry people after him!
:P
tra la la
Right Jass.
Darude, you should have shown some empathy which results in showing you care. Atleast it will be a weight off my chest that you will love and take care of your daughter/sister in a nice way even if I know you as a cyber name.
fazoooooooooooool and result nothing :D
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Well Mom,
Many guys dont care to understand this porblem... thats why it is still a problem.
tra la la
Darude and Syamsat, you have to be a female to understand what we are talking non stop about.
Da, Sometimes you are damn 'to the point' ;-)
Horrible!
Reminds me of the Warren Jeffs case here is the USA.
tra la la
Talks waaaay too much non stop like radio :?
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I have come from an educated family (both parents) and luckily married in a prgressive thinking family as well. But I have seen a lot of ladies being sort of secluded during 'that time' of the month. Although I am not sure if this has to do with education or compassion towards women (for that reason educated men go to strip clubs which I find is so dehumanizing for women) but anyway I feel being macho is not good for men as much as it is for women. I am not sure how people can kill their own kin and be happy with it later on. It sucks.
When I was young and in my family no one talked about anything and it was considered dirty then too.
Girls who fell into the family way because of family intern crises were automatically brand marked and wer dirt so to speak.
It is happening all over the world perhaps not in an equal way but now country can say it doesn't happen.
hashin
I agree with you many of these families live according to their way as they lived in Pakistan or India or wherever they came from. It is difficult for them to identify themselves with a culture which has changed faster on morals quicker than you can change your socks. On the other hand many families have readjusted and have good going businesses and live in a good cultural surrounding.
I watched a report on German television this morning where they were discussing the Turkish migration to Germany, here there are many honour killings - only not broadcast. They live in their own society and many keep to their own culture and go to their own supermarkets in fact in Muncih there is a smal part which is called small Istanbul. Problems start when the kids go to school they start to be involved in the German way of life and have to speak German which often many don't speak as they are not exposed to it.
Basically their hearts lie in there homeland although many have been there for forty years, they still work on the basisi they would do in Turkey.
Sorry DG. Wrong wordings from my side. Yes indeed the interpretation is wrong. It is not the religion.
the expatriate community from the subcontinent in Britain are stuck at the crossroads of Western and Eastern culture. The earlier generation wants to stick to their Eastern roots whereas as the younger generation wants to do what all the other kids do...
But that does not justify these crimes...
If people are so worried about their culture being eroded in a western society, maybe they should do themselves and everyone else a favour and just go back to where they came from... whats wrong with that?
I am from a conservative eastern culture myself and one of the main reasons I would never want to settle in the west is because I wouldn't want my son to adopt a culture that is not his own...
It's not the religion...it's some of the people who practise it and the things that come out of their mouths...
[img_assist|nid=57389|title=|desc=peace|link=none|align=left|width=|height=0] _______________________________________________________ Love is the answer...
Very true DG. I am appalled to find that in most of the religions menustration time is considered as dirty and women are generally treated as filthy. This automatically makes women hate their bodies and instill false self image.
Mom_me...simple. Power and control.
Men are afraid of women and their capabilities so they oppress them.
[img_assist|nid=57389|title=|desc=peace|link=none|align=left|width=|height=0] _______________________________________________________ Love is the answer...
I just want to ask a few questions :
1) Men who think they treat their women with respect will they be comfortable with a women as religious head. (No matter what religion they belong to).
2) Why is there a latent feeling that women are dirty. Isn't that the reason why there are no religious heads ?
Please men let me know why is women hated so much ?
hmmm soon i will delcare a law smokers not allowed on QL :D
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cappuchino and cigs for me.....
life's too short so make the most of it, you only live but once.......
then go and have cold shower quick move
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Thanks again I have added them to favourites to look at them when I have more time.
Oh yes, PM, on a widespread scale. I'm working to change that, though, one woman at a time if need be. Hope you can also visit the websites I've given and give a few moments to them :)
[img_assist|nid=57389|title=|desc=peace|link=none|align=left|width=|height=0] _______________________________________________________
Love is the answer...
Another good one:
www.vitalvoices.org
This one is great:
www.girlsspeakout.org
Everyone can do something to help. That's the only way things will change.
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Love is the answer...
Thank you I will check it out.
Canarybird, here is a website that pertains to the topic:
www.hrw.org
There is a whole section dedicated to Women's Rights. Sadly they need it :(
www.hrw.org/women/
[img_assist|nid=57389|title=|desc=peace|link=none|align=left|width=|height=0] _______________________________________________________
Love is the answer...
Well, Dweller, my view on hitting anyone regardless of their age (ie newborn to elderly) is well documented on a couple of threads on QL! No-one likes to be hit as a form of behaviour modification so why on earth would anyone hit anyone. It baffles me that people actually argue the case for hitting people (children are little people).
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Love is the answer...
never crossed my mind to hit a woman. From being a kid it was a definite no no!
I had a Palestinian woman boss in QP at one time believe it or not and never had a problem with her. She knew what she was doing so what if she was a woman.
Unfortunately, these barbaric practises are so embedded in a cloak of secrecy and fear that it is difficult to prevent them.
This is one of the problems with a multicultural soceity, communities can become closed and inpenetrable and any attempt to expose their shortcomings is interpreted as racist.
A few hundred years ago it was okay to drown women accused of being witches. Two hundred years ago slavery was considered the white man's right. These barbaric practises have been rightly outlawed and condemned. The same needs to be done within these backward communities that flout the laws of the land and basic humanity without regard to their ethnic group or 'culture'.
The time has come to substitute caution for courage. Martin Luther King, Birmingham, Alabama 1963
this is sadness. woman have the right to say NO and woman are not slave of the men.
Everybody is right and Everybody is wrong, its depend where you stand
If I knew how to help be sure I would as I think it is time well invested. However, I am not a part on any womens groups and have never heard anything about groups going in this direction.
Agree. Many men say they have the greatest respect for women but with the same tongue control their lives eg, who to marry, to marry at all!, where to work, where to go/not go, what to wear, etc.
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Love is the answer...
Women should be loved at all times, respect and give their rights. Cowards are those men who does not respect women nor they dont respect their own mother and sister at all.
Yes Canarybird, there are a great many issues concerning women world wide. It's up to everyone to play their part in taking action on these issues.
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Love is the answer...
Vegas, it really is that bad out there. The report is just the tip of the iceberg in ONE country.
Freedom for women to make their own choices through life is a fundamental right. It really pains me to think how some others live.
I hope people reading this will think about how they treat the women in their life. Do they exert some form of control over them however small they may think it is? I want men, particularly fathers, brothers and husbands to reflect on this issue. _______________________________________________________
Love is the answer...
Seems we have a chauvanistic society - at one time there was a matriarch society believe it or not.
However, a great many comments that were placed on the topic of female bosses I didn't take seriously, men have a huge problem in taking orders from a female boss. I have worked with males and females and our department has just changed to a female boss, the last male boss killed all of his secretaries with his loose mouth work.
The new boss is a Qatari and she is very clever as well as having a pleasing disposition.
The main issue is here how to stop girls being married under age and accosted or killed by family memebers. One other topic whihc has been in the news is the amount of girls still being cut who die from this procedure and although against the law in most countries it is still practiced.
Thank you your highness
NOW STOP HIJACKING :D
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DaRuDe, I can send you a soy latte??? Better for you than stewed tea lol.
[img_assist|nid=57389|title=|desc=peace|link=none|align=left|width=|height=0] _______________________________________________________ Love is the answer...
oh i again am really dishonored
ya tayeeb jeb wa7id karak
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I'm so sickened the sadness post in here...
Will it ever end...And is it that bad out there???
I just know I take care of the ladies I know
You got to do your best...
You can't teach experience...
I believe this type of behaviour is horrendous oppression against women and goes hand in hand with things like thinking it is OK to hit your wife, make all her decisions for her control her etc.
I am also reminded of the topic last week about female bosses and how it was posted that a man's dignity would be compromised if he had a female boss.
To me it is all part of the same mindset. Men believing they are superior and therefore ' in charge' of ' their' women.
[img_assist|nid=57389|title=|desc=peace|link=none|align=left|width=|height=0] _______________________________________________________
Love is the answer...
i am dishonored
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What a sin. :(
"I am not a pretty girl, that is not what I do, I ain't no damsel in distress and I don't need to be rescued. So put me down punk, I'm not a maiden fair, maybe there's a kitten stuck up a tree somewhere." Ani Difranco
It's really sickening!
"There's nothing we can do to change the past, if it teaches you a lesson profit from it then, forget it."
I remember when I went to school we had two Indian girls there, they were very pretty, one day one of the girls did not come to school anymore and here sister told me she was married. As she live in the same street as the school I did see her often after that and I do remember too, the man she was married to was at least twenty years her senior and very fat. The next year hardly 14 she had her first baby. The same thing happened to the younger sister.
So these pre-arranged and under age marriages have gone on for years.
I just remember thinking with my 13 years thank goodness it will be a long time until I get married and I can choose my partner alone. I am lucky
thanks maraim-mar for posting. I'm trying to highlight the plight of women like this, not only in the UK but worldwide. It's tragic.
[img_assist|nid=57389|title=|desc=peace|link=none|align=left|width=|height=0] _______________________________________________________ Love is the answer...
This is serious. Ladies let's raise the "TITANIC" !!!! There must be something to be done....
"There's nothing we can do to change the past, if it teaches you a lesson profit from it then, forget it."