Expat incest realtionship in Ajman (UAE)

Kids at the age of 12-14 are still considered as children. That's the time they start understanding their existence but their innocent feelings were brutally crushed by this maniac. I can imagine what fear & trauma they must have undergone by not able to understand why this father figure is behaving in an uncomfortable way & then the trauma they underwent thru him. I am sure they must have hid the reality at first because no one wants to be accused of such things but later on their only hope & protection, their mum, also turned them down they were left of no choice. I am sure for first few times they must have reacted very badly & tried to defend themselves but any child of such age is helpless & powerless in front of a man double or triple their age. What I feel that once they knew that no one is going to save them & they lost their faith & hope in the most respectful relations, they must have given up to his wishes, because whatever is happening forcefully let it happen peacefully. I do not blame girls at all in all this situation & I do not blame them for not standing up because when their mother refused to help then whom to look forward to?

I commend the bravery of the youngest daughter, I hope that was the first time that maniac tried to attack her but she didnt let him have her & reported. Its really commendable that she didnt let her life to be lived in all this sadness & sorrow just like her other sisters & taught him a lesson.

At first, we should not take any word from that guy as truth maybe he tried to escape by saying that not all children were fathered by him or maybe he simply wanted to lessen his punishment by tarnishing / blaming the young girls.

But, by any chance, if he is right & those girls were involved with some other man/men too still we need to sympathise with them that maybe they fell in love with someone, told him about their story & that guy took advantage of them by promising of marriage but later on simply used them like this maniac & left forever. The girl / girls might have trusted this new person & looked upon as saviour & when he advanced they dint stop because this was their blind trust in the guy plus this s****al act was not new for them & they were used to it. But being an illiterate they were unable to understand that even if this new man is claiming to be their saviour, this should be done under a marital contract which could give this relationship a legal meaning. I blame girls only to be used by this new person & that's the 2% I was referring in my earlier post. But still this case needs to be looked with sympathy rather than giving them 80 lashes punishment for no mistake of their own. They should be counselled & as already their stories are being published in newspapers, most of the ppl like us must be feeling from their heart for them. I wish some good character ppl come forward & marry & protect them for the rest of their lives & help them lessen the pain of what they have undergone.

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CONFUSE ............ if you cannot convince!

The step father in the story is the most horrible character. I am sure being illiterate his s***al desires overcame his mind & he commited all that crime. I, personally, feel he should not be released at all because by getting deported he's free to commit all those crime again to some other innocents. He should really have been stoned to death if they go by Islamic sentence or hanged publicly to death so that he becomes an example to any other aspiring maniac like him.

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CONFUSE ............ if you cannot convince!

In context with my yesterday's post I understand from the tragic incident that the family was a bunch of illiterate ppl & generally illiterates cannot differentiate evil & good to some extent.

* Her relationship with the man:-

The role of mother was very evil in this story that we read but I feel that maybe (as we are not aware of the reality & real story & all our viewpoints are based on the incident published in the newspaper) the lady did 'Nikah' with this man in front of some molvi so per Islamic conditions they are man & wife but because they didnt apply for a formal Nikah paper doesnt make their relationship illegitimate because for that you need to have witnesses by your side & because asian cultures frown upon a woman with children to remarry she wanted to hide it for sometime & later on when the relationship to that man was out she didnt mind not applying for the Nikah Contract or maybe because of sheer ignorance & not understanding the consequences she might face in future she didnt apply.

* Letting her daughters in the hands of husband:-

Maybe she was forced by her husband to allow him to do whatever he wanted to do with the kids but I maintain still she shouldn't have allowed him to do so. Maybe she was convinced by her husband that because they are not his real daughters so it wont be a sin & being an illiterate she agreed. Maybe he didnt talk to her at all & paid unwanted visits to the children & acted like maniac. But when she finally knew what's happening to her kids she should have protected them but as per my understanding, to illiterates the means of income or food is more important than honour & maybe because of this faith she closed her eyes towards all the horrible crimes happening to her children.

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CONFUSE ............ if you cannot convince!

4 people.

It is premature to pronounce any judgment or decision at QL, as we heard this story from newpapers.

UAE court has not given the full story (I am very sure, to maintain dignity and modesty of the parties involved in the case) and deported the guilty.

Why we don't want to agree that this is a prejudice case?

well if he were in saudi arabia .. his head could have rolled long time ago since he was sentenced GUILTY as charged! .. and he would never see his country again!

Hmmmn .... I think if I can carry on with a conversation or debate with decency others can do that so. There is no point in calling ppl with names whom you dont know. In a healthy discussion both the parties listen to all the viewpoints & later on if they disagree they can give examples to make their point little stronger but I dont see any reason to convince others. I do not want to drag religion to this but just for the example I'll say if I am a Christian & you are a Muslim that doesnt mean that being a Muslim you are following a wrong religion because 'you are not following my religion & being a christian I am the only one who is on the right path'

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CONFUSE ............ if you cannot convince!

We have read all your posts FT, and you say the same thing again and again, that the girls deserve their punishment.

No my dear friend i wasnt trying to defend anyone but there is not point explaining you since you are getting too excited just take a chill pill and read all my post

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When the eye becomes the heart, the heart becomes the eye ... Wasif Ali Wasif

You are talking shite! This debate has nothing to do with academic ability it is about empathy with children that were RAPED, ABUSED AND NEGLECTED. You have defended the parents1 If you have tried to play the devils advocate, you made a poor job of it.

consciouseffort only thing i was trying to establish before all this usual bashing was that there is a grey area that need to be investigated and it was my view not judgement but people here will start questioning your academics background and intlectual abilities if you have a different point of view.

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When the eye becomes the heart, the heart becomes the eye ... Wasif Ali Wasif

Those children did nothing wrong! Idiot.

Hmmn ... I was silently reading everyone's comment & FT's stance on this issue. I think, FT, u have taken up that particular point of that guy where he said he didnt father all children of girls & that's the prime reason you consider those girls guilty too. And at this (weak) point I too blame girls but not for the crime that happened with them since they were naive but from the time they understood this is wrong. But as usual every coin has a two sided story & I put this blame 98% on the mother + illegitimate father & only 2% on the girls. Why? Because the story clearly tells us that the members of that family are illiterate. If we go step by step we'll be able to understand it much better. I have witnessed almost similar kind of incident with one of my very very close friend & even at the age of 30+ those traces of inhumane acts & trauma related to it didnt leave her soul. I'll continue with it tomorrow insha Allah as its time for me to leave :) Good bye to all.

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CONFUSE ............ if you cannot convince!

Honestly speaking I was taking it as a compliment, gypsy

Madam PM it was nothing less then a favour that despite knowing compassinate and rational people you still spared some time to answer my idiotic comments btw say hello to all.

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When the eye becomes the heart, the heart becomes the eye ... Wasif Ali Wasif

Read back through the thread Frozen, everyone's been calling you an idiot since the beginning.

PM you finally got company, see all this time you thought you are alone in this.

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When the eye becomes the heart, the heart becomes the eye ... Wasif Ali Wasif

is this my fan club?

when did i gave you a bad name i think all this time i was calling you hesa is it a bad name?

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When the eye becomes the heart, the heart becomes the eye ... Wasif Ali Wasif

Nice to see you're proud of it.

FT - that comment of yours is disgusting. It is people like you who give others a bad name.

atlast you READ that statement? thanks to me

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When the eye becomes the heart, the heart becomes the eye ... Wasif Ali Wasif

Easy Prey??? That is the most disgusting statement I've heard in a long time.

OMG - "easy prey"?!? THEY WERE CHILDREN!!!! Young and Naive.

I am just saying try to put yourself in their position - how would you cope with it? You seem so happy to blame the children, but I bet you would have done exactly the same if it were you.

No Hesa even if i try putting my self in thier shoes I wont be an easy prey and honestly speaking ten years are too much for me to book one way flight to hell for that sex maniac couple.

and gypsy actually so nice of you for thinking me a lot, r u trying to hack my mind? r u playing rasputin here.

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When the eye becomes the heart, the heart becomes the eye ... Wasif Ali Wasif

Most men, especially in this region, CAN'T put themselves in the mind of the victim, frozen tear is a prime example of this. They've spent their entire lives being told women are to blame for what happens to them. I'm sure in his mind Frozen tear is thinking that this would never have happened to these girls if they'd worn hijab or niqab.

Frozen Tear - you didn't answer my post. Put yourself in the position of the poor girls - what would you do? Honestly?

People who blame VICTIMS of rape for what has happened to them make me feel physically sick. Especially children.

Many countries have a LEGAL age of consent which is to determine whether or not the minor in question has the ability to determine what is right and wrong. In the UK, any sexual relations with someone under 16, if you are over 16, is rape, pure and simple.

thats the case with me neither i care what you do for living but find it at odds when you question somebody's academic qualification or intelictuall abilities like an old time school teacher.

being an under privileged child who didnt go to school I used the methods like Saadi Shirazi to somehhow educate myself specially like questioning the scholars or pretending like one.

If I ought to know who i am what i do then why do i need a nickname and avatar to partially hide myself.

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When the eye becomes the heart, the heart becomes the eye ... Wasif Ali Wasif

Yes PM checking QL for sometime now anybody can realize that you are a teacher but that is your profession, how do you think when you are not teaching or you are not on duty for a change, for God sake come out of campus.

While reading my post did you ever got any hint of my professin?

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When the eye becomes the heart, the heart becomes the eye ... Wasif Ali Wasif

cases like these are unfortunatly not uncommen, they all have the same pattern of fear and control, confinement from education and 'the outside world'. Are you really not aware of the cases thousands of grown men and women whom it takes years, if not decades, to talk to someone about the abuse they suffered as children. Are they all complicit through their silence?

this case rings so true

"Deaths in the Bible. God - 2,270,365

not including the victims of Noah's flood, Sodom and Gomorrah, or the

many plagues, famines, fiery serpents, etc because no specific numbers

were given. Satan - 10."

No adey i dont generalize all the rape victims as unclean whores but i form my opinion on case to case basis and btw who told you to respect my opinion? for example if some body from your family is constantly getting raped for years and you got that info from outside sources what will be your first reaction?

and PM i never been to school and you are talking about university but why do you always sound like a teacher?

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When the eye becomes the heart, the heart becomes the eye ... Wasif Ali Wasif

they will nee therapy in a big way and one of the ways they can be helped is to see that other victims will be treated with more respect than they have. I honestly think this is a long way of though.

PM, the girls need therapy. even if they're in their 20-30s, what they experienced as children is irreparable damage.

How true, people think we are blind to what is happening. As though we don't get media reports and internet blogs. I can well understand there may be many that are not true but on the whole most are accurate!

unlike you i didn't read ONE article and jump to the conclusion that all rape victims must be unclean whores who were asking for it.

Hey, think themselves lucky they didn't get battery acid in their faces.

But I am told I must respect your veiws.....so I will and be happy to tell you that if anyone in your family happens to be raped.

"Deaths in the Bible. God - 2,270,365

not including the victims of Noah's flood, Sodom and Gomorrah, or the

many plagues, famines, fiery serpents, etc because no specific numbers

were given. Satan - 10."

rape victims are not that rare. Most women, even if they haven't been raped themselves, have a close friend or relative who has been the victim of some sort of sexual assault.

So even though we all have only read this small snippet in the news about this one story, many of us can probably make some accurate guesses about how the father took advantage of these young girls, the tactics he used, the things he said, the way they felt, the fears they had....

You're right, of course; none of us will fully understand what happened by simply reading this article. But please don't demean what many of us have come to understand through our own experience with this horrific crime.

We actually DO know what we're talking about...believe us.

Yes adey reading an article in a local newspaper I totally failed to understand the psychology of particular rape victims specially when the whole course of those unfortunate events spread over 10 years.

Can you understand their psychology just by reading an article not even seeing them or talking to them? then i must commend you for having this ability.

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When the eye becomes the heart, the heart becomes the eye ... Wasif Ali Wasif

I used to work in Child Protection, my PhD was in Child Protection in Asian states and there is NOTHING in place at all! There are Human Rights Lawyers going in etc. However, nothing can and will be done. Religion and village mentallity plays such a big part.

These people are at least 100 years behind, they can make all the noises they like about Westernisation, they don't want it, they can't hack it and they hate the idea of it.

I think, as sad as it is, the West needs to back off and revisit in 50 years, they may be ready to talk then.

...probably before they could conduct DNA testing on all the offspring, so we'll most likely never know whether or not he fathered ALL of their children or not.

I'd bet good money on the fact that he probably won't be sending any child support checks to help care for the ones he DID sire, though.

But even if he didn't father ALL of them -- and you're not going to get this point, Frozen, I know -- by abusing them so young, he set them up for a lifelong pattern of engaging in inappropriate relationships and sexual acting out that will manifest itself in their exchanging sex for affection and not maintaining appropriate boundaries in relationships with men.

So again, I would argue they are not responsible for this; he's basically f***ed them up for life and that is something HE should be held responsible for.

then it just shows you know nothing about the psychology of rape victims.

but then that doesn't surprise me.

"Deaths in the Bible. God - 2,270,365

not including the victims of Noah's flood, Sodom and Gomorrah, or the

many plagues, famines, fiery serpents, etc because no specific numbers

were given. Satan - 10."

PM I am not here to talk about how institution tried to cover up the whole mess, well if she was getting threats from tribal heads a big number of people were in support aswell. Yes it took a week to report that case but finally it happend dont you think 10 years is too much.

Well i could be wrong in it but i see that act as a silent consent.

What about the statement of that guy that he not the father of all those illegtimate children? in that case what will be the standing of those girls ? guilty or not

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When the eye becomes the heart, the heart becomes the eye ... Wasif Ali Wasif

it is often seen as the womans role to preserve her 'honour' at all costs - even to the detriment of their own lives. Thus some men will always hold women complicit no matter what the circumstances are.

"Deaths in the Bible. God - 2,270,365

not including the victims of Noah's flood, Sodom and Gomorrah, or the

many plagues, famines, fiery serpents, etc because no specific numbers

were given. Satan - 10."

that they were assulted and raped while mere children.

Now, let's see if I can address the big "BUT..." in your argument.

You seem to think that because the girls didn't report the rape/abuse, they bear some responsibility for it continuing. I'm not trying to put words in your mouth here, so correct me please if this is inaccurate.

You cite a specific example -- Mukhtara Mai -- to show what, I guess, you think SHOULD have occurred. While I think most people are in awe of the resolve and strength that Mukhtara Mai showed in facing her accusers and not simply accepting the trauma of being gang raped by some neighboring villagers, you need to understand, I think, that it is a rare person who has that kind of strength (especially so considering that she was a woman in a very male-dominated tribal society). Additionally, Mukhtara had her father and family behind her, supporting her in her pursuit of justice against those men.

The young girls in the UAE -- now young women -- endured nearly a decade of abuse by a man who was, for all intents and purposes, their step-father. Even their mother was complicit in the abuse. Given that they were victims of abuse at the hands of family members, can you understand that they perhaps felt quite alone in their suffering? Maybe their mother even portrayed it as something that they had to allow to continue or else they ALL would get into trouble (I mean, who knows what was said to who by whom -- I am merely speculating here -- but incest is, unfortunately, not a rare and isolated event, so we can make educated guesses about what might have happened for it to have been kept a secret for so very long).

The original article even states that the family moved around within the UAE once neighbors began to wonder about things. So again, the family is actively working against the truth coming to light by moving everyone somewhere else where nobody knows the girls and they have no friends/support from outside...

And don't forget that they were living in a society that has very harsh viewpoints about and consequences for sex outside of marriage. And being uneducated, they would have had to rely upon whatever their step-father and mother told them might happen to them if they ever did tell someone about the abuse (so if they were told he would kill them or that they would get thrown in jail if they told anyone, why WOULD they report it to the police? It's self-preservation to keep your mouth shut.).

Considering ALL of this...do you still think it is reasonable to expect them to have reported the abuse? One certainly wishes ALL victims were as strong as Mukhtara, but the reality is that they're not.

Lets face facts, these peoples laws are wrong. Young girls were abused at many levels, rape, cannot really be incest as he was not a blood relative (unless he raped his own kids later on). The girls were deprived of an education and probably kept in squalor (my guess, but one I reckon is spot on). The mother lied at so many levels. She was in fact living 'in sin' as she was not married and had illegitimate kids (against the law), she allowed HER children to be raped and abused.

At all levels these CHILDREN were let down by both of these adults and now they are being let down by some other adults who are supposed to be versed in law and are in fact supposed to help the victims of crime not help the person/people that has broken the law.

It is wrong, but what can any of us do. These people for all their pretence and money still live in the dark ages. Dubai threw 2 people in jail for having 'sex' on a beach, and quite rightly so, they to broke a law. And yet, they allow a rapist/paedophile to walk away scott free and his victims are to suffer more.

This region may have all the wealth, they may pretend to have high morals because of their religion but yet time and time again they behave just as badly or in some cases worse than the Western standards they say they hate.

If they do want to be seen as forward thinking and put their money where their mouth is, they should embrace international law and stop hiding behind a religious law that is centuries old.

Fubar if you heard or read about hudood ordinance then you must have heard about women protection law passed last year through parliament. So the existance of one law will convert the status of that country from muslim state to Islamic state, then what about America is it a christian state or secular state.

No ummjake in my view whatever happend to those girls in the begining when they were in thier early teens was definetly a criminal act and as i said earlier the guy need to be punished but hiding that crime for 10 years was another crime that they committed.

If you want to give them benefit of doubt that they were threatened with knives and traumatized then i can quote you dozen of examples when those ladies took a bold stand for example mukhtara mai.

And just for the record I am not endorsing the judgement of UAE courts.

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When the eye becomes the heart, the heart becomes the eye ... Wasif Ali Wasif

for posting such thread at QL but ignored as usual and blocked the user. Such mails made me more strong to post more controversial social, high profile and white collars crimes.

Lets forget the nationality or country of offence and think from a humanitarian case and do justice with victim and punish the guilty severely.

Such a serious case. Girls getting punished for no fault of theirs. I wish both mother & father were not allowed to live anymore on this planet in order to save it from more dirt. Such a shame.

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CONFUSE ............ if you cannot convince!

Frozen Tear - lets turn it around. Put yourself in the position of the poor girls. What would you do? You would hide yourself away and cry yourself to sleep every night. Hoping it would all go away and wake up to find it all a nightmare.

Also, do we not have the age of consent to determine what is and is not rape. Any sexual activity occuring before the age of consent means the individual involved is not old enough to make an informed choice?!?

Frozen Tear, I find it increasingly difficult to believe that you are Pakistani if even you haven't heard of the Hudood Ordinances

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hudood_Ordinance

They are very well known and controversial within Pakistan, and have been a topic of much debate outside Pakistan too.

...how you see lashing the young women that he raped when they were 12-14 years old is "justice to be served without exception".

I would agree that the man and the girls' mother both deserve punishment. But what exactly did the girls do that was wrong and deserves punishment?

Do you think 12 is an age at which a child becomes legally responsible for their actions? Do you view sexual crimes as something that BOTH parties consent to, no matter the ages or situation involved?

I'm genuinely trying to understand your point of view here, frozen tear of love, but I'm having a hard time. I understand you're not condoning what the man has done, but like the UAE judge, you're criminalizing the girls for something that happened TO them -- and that's what I don't get. Please explain your reasoning for me.

Oryx have you ever read my post supporting or defending the culprit, i guess not. I regard your sentiment but pls dont misjudge, to me justice to be served without exception.

and PM ridiculing any religious figure from any religion or school of thought was never my practice but some people in QL are having this hidden agenda.

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When the eye becomes the heart, the heart becomes the eye ... Wasif Ali Wasif

You can go to the eastern states of India any day and have child prostitutes, their parents are happy that their children are bringing in the money for the household, in fact the girls look forward to being child prostitutes at a young age before puberty. I wonder how many Indian men here in Qatar have used their services, I know of 2 Indian men that have told the story. Child sex is no big deal to them

It is always the lost that need my guidance

Umm Jake thank you for having the patience to explain this.

these girls were illiterate........

Literacy and your personal health and well being go hand in hand....

FT - dont judge others without trying to understand their perspective.. can you have any idea what it is to be an illiterate 12yearold girl, threatened at knife point with your mother allowing this??????

If you died FT would you want this to happen to your daughters.... ???

This man is a dangerous paedophile and should have been punished to the full extent of the law.

Women's education should be a priority everywhere.

coz in islam there is no concept of democracy but Khilafat.

Its not governed by sharia laws.

The white strip on the corner portray existance of non muslims.

95% muslims yes coz this state was made for muslims and for the same reason a non-muslim cannot run for presidency.

my friend dont mix an islamic state with a state made for muslim that was the only point i was conveying but I would like to know which sharia laws are imposed on non muslims.

Anyways I think we are discussing off topic.

Pm you didnt answer me is there any scholar whom you endorse? just for my knowledge.

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When the eye becomes the heart, the heart becomes the eye ... Wasif Ali Wasif

Islam...and Pakistan? BTW please...

Gypsy, I feel its my error while reading your comment with 5 exclamation and 5 question marks, didn't get your point. anyways Peace.

Have a nice evening

Just because it's called the Islamic Republic of Pakistan doesn't mean it's an Islamic Country.

Just because it's legal system uses a modified version of English law to accomodate Islamic, Shariah law doesn't mean it's an Islamic Country.

Just because the flag clearly portrays Islamic iconography doesn't mean it's an Islamic country.

Just because 95% of the population is Islamic doesn't mean it's an Islamic country.

Just because non-muslims are barred from running for president doesn't mean it's an Islamic country.

Just because the Islam-derived laws are applied to both Muslims and non Muslims doesn't mean it's an Islamic country.

Wait a minute.............

No suprises really....

Even if there is a factor of concent , 12 and 14 are minors and its STILL considered as a RAPE in many advanced countries.

Women are just objects in this part of the world. covered and refrigerated for longer usage.. hmmm ya.. and men rules.

______________________________________________

Listen to Many..Speak to a few.

Yes frozen, cause I always call people women hating cavemen as a compliment. >:P

Shall I take it as a compliment? gypsy

Sorry for disagreeing you on this PM but Pakistan never claimed to be an Islamic Nation. Pakistan was made for the muslims of sub continent yet some muslim choose not to be a part of it.

But right from the day one it was declared that it will be governed by democracy but none of the rules or regulation should be against Islam aswell.

But can you tell me the motive of forming a state in Yathrib some 1400 years ago?

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When the eye becomes the heart, the heart becomes the eye ... Wasif Ali Wasif

VB, if I misunderstood what you said I do apologize. Frozen, you on the other hand are 100% wrong in your comments, and are nothing but a Neanderthalic misogynist.

huh? you have already used your brain? then i wonder what you would say if you're not using it. :(

Sorry Mr. Victor time for clarification finished the judgement is already being passed by hounerable ladies here and you and I were also found guilty.

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When the eye becomes the heart, the heart becomes the eye ... Wasif Ali Wasif

about consent; i just responded to Gypsy on that context.

I agree with Umm, there is no question of consent arise when it is a case of minor girls got raped by their step-father for several years. I believe that you are really blessed to have such wonderful parents like us who cared and protect their children till they use the last drop of blood.

"If the misogynist, Neandertal types on here had five brain cells to share with one another, then I might have some hope for modest social advancement in this region"...to high for my understanding.

I understand the pain, embrassment, guilt and trauma, one who goes through such oppression.

However I again Reiterate UAE Courts should clarify the status how and why they deported the culprit, person who found guilty? There could be something under the carpet...and no transparency in the case.

Let me correct you, Islam was never made in Pakistan neither we have a different interpetition of Islam but can you further define what exactly you mean by jahaliya and are you sure you are talking about main stream islam or something like nation of islam.

And just for my understanding is there any religious scholar whom you endorse to be rightly guided?

I really want to carry out this discussion in a different forum but I really wonder why do you always drag islam in all discussion.

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When the eye becomes the heart, the heart becomes the eye ... Wasif Ali Wasif

"so if they consented...?"

Can someone actually consent to a crime being committed against them? And then be held guilty/complicit in it?

And since when can a 12 year old consent to ANYTHING legally?

Following this line of logic, then I guess anyone who has ever been held up at gunpoint or threatened with bodliy harm and then surrendered their money/car/jewelry to their assailant...well, they actually weren't robbed, they simply made a donation to someone.

If the misogynist, Neandertal types on here had five brain cells to share with one another, then I might have some hope for modest social advancement in this region...but unfortunately, I don't. Even some of the women leave me disappointed...

Threads like this just leave me thinking how blessed I am to have educated, loving parents who would cut off their left leg to spare me any abuse; to have grown up in a culture that teaches me that I am no less than a man.

It saddens me to think of all the children that will grow up surrounded by these archaic attitudes...and it makes me disappointed that a region of the world that has so much potential will probably never fully realize it because of its backwards mentality about half its citizenry and its apparent disregard for the safety and security of its children.

frozen,,,,please look up the word "Misogyny",

Yes arcel I am trying to use my brain just for a change.. happy

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When the eye becomes the heart, the heart becomes the eye ... Wasif Ali Wasif

sorry pm if you are disappointed by the thoughts of a Muslim men specially Pakistani but I am passing my comments not judgement whereas the ladies in the post are trying to justify their actions and rediculing whoever is not agreeing with them.

Not agreeing with you doesnt make me stupid, you have your own view point, I have mine.

Why always these selected ladies in QL are always starting catfight.

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When the eye becomes the heart, the heart becomes the eye ... Wasif Ali Wasif

did you really think that when a woman get raped, afterwards she just can go on with her life as if nothing happens? you said if it is rape, they could have told the other people? hello, do you understand what fear/ trauma is? can you even imagine the shame that these women had felt when they are being violated? it's because of the likes of you that think it's the women's fault that they are raped and that is why they keep their silence.

I second that PM, the step-father and the girls' mother's behavior is much worse than that of an animal. Don't animals try to, in the very least, protect their young?

frozen tear of love, please use your brain sometimes, okay kiddo?

Ummjake and gypsy, honestly, I don't believe half these people believe in what they are writing, I think they are just trying to stir the pot.

Better to leave this discussion alone, because those guys are starting to make my skin crawl.

Victor there is NO evidence of consent at all, and yes if they were forced into prositution, then the mother and step father should be charged. There's a key word in all of this it's FORCED.

Muya WTF are you talking about? Are you defending the rapist as well?

Have u been raped before Gypsy?

No?

Then shut up please

Rape victims are human, so are rapists

All of them and all of us are flawed, it depends on our choices and that of the systems controlling us to decide whose flows are worse, and which flows are worth punishing, my and your agreement are not required here. But u coming from utopia won't understand something like that would u?

the case of prostitu... will be charged to these young females....and man & woman (mother) both should be charged for forcing them for pros...

Then why my question still stays....for UAE courts allowed deportation.

Sorry gypsy, I am not in a position to understand thier psyschi, so you can definetly explain it better out of your experience.

No No I am not coming for you girls coz i am having a flu and a good taste.

filthy relationship of Pakistani to an Indian?

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HE WHO DARES WINS

So Victor Bhatt because they were too scared to come forward they obviously consented!!!!?????

Jesus H. Christ does nobody in this region understand anything at all about rape victims and their emotional and physical abuse that they have to go through? It's like talking to Neanderthals!

who were raped and got pregnant, when they were minors or teenaged. The case came into light only when reported by eldest daughter to the police.

We could not deny the facts that there could be some accomodation or mutual consents; Why, because these girls were not put under captivity/hostage but were freely roaming (unlike in case of Fraser).

These girls are uneducated and must be afraid to talk until they get well aware of their social status in the society and hence reported for justice.

UAE Courts should clarify the status how and why they deported the culprit, person who found guilty?

There could be something under the carpet...

Lets put your points with proper justification.

Are you coming onto us, frozen tear of love?

Oops! My mistake -- if we're teens, we're probably too old for your tastes, huh?

It may not be Abdul Aziz, but you're obviously as ignorant as he is.

Read the article Frozen Tear, they said the girls and their children were uneducated, couldn't read and had never been to school. You don't know what this man was telling them, they may not have known there was anyone they could turn to.

Hello gypsy and ummjake my name is not abdul aziz and stop acting like teens

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When the eye becomes the heart, the heart becomes the eye ... Wasif Ali Wasif

Ummjake, don't waste your breath with Frozen Tear. He's an example of the kind of ignorance that will keep this region in the stone age for the next hundred years.

...as to why you seem so eager to blame a pre-teen for her father figure raping her.

"Abdul Aziz, a Pakistani, was sentenced for repeatedly raping the four Emirati girls, who were then aged between 12-14."

Yes, they're young women now, but the abuse began when they were CHILDREN. Why can you not wrap your brain around this fact?!?

But, of course, you're right; since the girls didn't tell anyone or try to escape, that CLEARLY indicates that they lusted after him and wanted this man. Trying to make it sound as if they were the victims... honestly, do they think the rest of the world is so stupid that we can't see through this thin facade?

Are you even listening to yourself???

Can you even imagine?

You're a twelve year old girl. The man who has been living with your family and acting the part of your father has suddenly started touching you inappropriately and forcing you to do awful things. You tried to tell you mother, but she doesn't seem to want to do anything (maybe she's afraid that this man who has been taking care of her will leave her or cause problems for her, so she tries not to make waves)...so his late night visits to your room continue.

You're living in a culture that routinely blames victims for sexual offenses. So do you think you'd be inclined to go outside of your family and tell someone else about what has been happening, or do you think you might keep your mouth shut and hope that it will stop soon?

Don't forget that this man is alleged to have been threatening the girls with knives ("The victims, who are now aged between 23 and 28, told the judge, Abdul Aziz used to threaten them with a knife, forcing them to surrender to him.").

The only think I can say is that I sincerely hope that you are never in a position to be responsible for children. Ever.

"The victims, who are now aged between 23 and 28, told the judge, Abdul Aziz used to threaten them with a knife, forcing them to surrender to him.

Police said Abdul Aziz and the woman lived together for several years. Police said that when neighbours and relatives in Al Ain noticed something was wrong, the couple moved to Ajman.

The girls told police that some of their children were born in India and some in the UAE. Their mother used to tell people in the UAE that her daughters were married in India and she used to tell relatives in India that her daughters were married in the UAE."

Its good to know that you are an expert, but if the girls want they could have easily told someone or escaped but they didnt. on the other side the guy is saying that he is the father of some of those kids but not to all.

Anyways its a difference of opinion to me their story is not convincing enough to me all the culprits including the man and those ladies need to be punished without exception.

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When the eye becomes the heart, the heart becomes the eye ... Wasif Ali Wasif

...but having grown up with parents in the mental health field, I know enough about sexual abuse and trauma to find your perspective quite off-putting, frozen tear of love.

The girls were 12-14 when the abuse by their 'step-father' began. And you've written something that basically compares them to prostitutes...

I don't know about you, but I call men who prey on twelve and fourteen year olds pedophiles. They should get thrown in jail, not deported so they can abuse more children.

And their child victims shouldn't get punished because they "must have" wanted it or done something to encourage his advances.

Your understnding of my post was totally wrong. I'am disgusted at the mother's stand at the repeated rape of her children and her inability to act. Through my post,I tried to express that discomfort.

Life is Beautiful...Indeed!

completely horrible..

my dear google scholars ummjake and arcel, sorry i just dont read a few websites and consider myself a scholar. You have to understand the whole situation the mom was simple telling lies in India and Ajman did the guy forced her to do that or it was that so called trauma that you googled.

The guy definetly need to be punished but you cannot give a clean chit to that ladies too.

If some prostitutes get caught in police raid their first statement is always "he was blackmailing me, or he was doing it without my will"

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When the eye becomes the heart, the heart becomes the eye ... Wasif Ali Wasif

horrible and unbelievable, i feel sorry for the kids,

i feel authorities should protect and educate them to be a better citizens of tomorrow.

i feel some questions are never answered...

Simpleman is loving everyone

:):):)

What a shame. The victims are punished and the criminals are set free.

this is a traumatic situation only those who have proper understanding of such incident could realise.

Think guys this won't be Easy for any mother to offer her child to a beast for feast!

There are elements like threat, blackmail, conspiracy, social dilemma involved in hiding such cases for long time. But these criminals forget their GOD.

Life is beautiful , you obviously have no idea what the word "rape" means. If you are forced to have sex (of any kind) against your will - it's rape. It seems from what you wrote, if it's reported, it's rape - most rapes go unreported (a) because the victim is traumatized (b) they fear they won't be believed (c) they just want to get on with their lives because (1) people like you won't believe them (2) people like you will blame them (3) they just want to get on with their lives.

As for the mother "agreeing" to it rather than reporting it - that makes it OK? How about if your Mom put you (or a female relative) into a prostitution ring - hey that's OK too? Same thing here , Mom profits (because hubby is still around to support her) at the expense of an innocent 3rd party. Disgraceful and disgusting, she should be jailed as well.

I hope you (if you are female) are never in a situation like these children or that any female relative you have is never in a situation like this. The guy should have been jailed for life and compensation and counselling given to the victims.

Great country and great rules..

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Listen to Many..Speak to a few.

...this is something else...if it was rape...it would have been reported. I guess the mom opposed but then agreed to the 'relationship' with her daughter in return for something...money? Protection? lol :))

Strange world we live in ! And why did the death penalty get revoked??? Are these guys nucking futs?

Life is Beautiful...Indeed!

agree bleu...waste of oxygen and space.

frozen tear of love, perhaps you should google "incest" or "rape" first before making such stupid comment. really. go ahead, google...

huhhh !!

rms..!!

frozen tear of love, could fill a book!

In most cases, the crime goes unreported and unnoticed. The victim are fearful of being blamed (hmm...I wonder why?), and they often develop warped feelings of love for the perpetrator (it's common for pedophiles to tell their victims that they are special, to better enable the abuse).

The mother is definitely complicit in this whole thing, and most assuredly the father is, since he was physically, sexually and emotionally abusing the entire household of females.

I find it unconscionable that a court would allow this man to go free and would punish these young women now for somehow "agreeing" to be raped by their so-called step-father.

Yet another depressing example of how the legal system in the Gulf fails to effectively protect women and children. All those shiny skyscrapers are just a facade; this region still behaves like it's trapped in the 5th century.

He should have been stoned to death, or drowned, or shot,.... This f**k is wasting our air.

My friend you can hide the fact for year, offcourse no whatever being done was done with consent otherwise the incidence could have reported within few weeks.

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When the eye becomes the heart, the heart becomes the eye ... Wasif Ali Wasif

It seems the authorities wanted to wash their hands of this mess, so deported the guy.

Sad case and sadder still for the girls..

"The four girls were sentenced to 80 lashes each. The girls were charged with "allowing" the man to have sex with them."

How exactly does a child allow a man to rape her? And at knife-point too. Brilliant.

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