CID 'short skirt' patrol in villaggio?
I was in Carrefour in Villaggio on Thursday around 4.30 pm with my 16 year old son, when I was approached by a Carrefour employee and a young local guy wearing a thobe and sunglasses. The Carrefour guy said 'Excuse me madam, but this gentleman is with the CID and would like to check your ID and talk to you about your clothes'. I was wearing a short-ish skirt and t-shirt. OK, so I gave him my ID card, he took it without a word and proceeded to walk to the check-outs. The Carrefour guy told me I must follow him. Meanwhile my son was rather worried, but I told him it would be ok, just wait for me.
So the CID man walked out of Carrefour, into a small shop opposite which sells cufflinks, pens, etc. He spoke to the shopkeeper in Arabic, who then translated. Basically, he was saying I was inappropriately dressed and should cover up more, and must leave the Mall immediately. He spoke absolutely no English at all, not ONE WORD.
I queried the fact that he was CID and asked to see his ID - saying that my own daughter is a police officer in the UK, and the first thing she must do when she stops someone whilst on duty, is to produce her warrant card and badge to confirm her identity. This man had NO ID, no pen or paper and nothing to confirm he was a police officer. As I said, he spoke no English whatsoever. Not wishing to inflame the situation, I merely smiled, said 'OK, I come to this mall every day, very often dressed like this and have never had a problem, but I take your point'
The shopkeeper was at pains to point out that everything would be all right, and the man was really with the police, but I am not convinced.
Shouldn't a police officer have ID?? A friend of mine was recently fined for smoking in Starbucks, and was spoken to by a CID guy who very definitely had identification. So, was he just a local guy who takes it upon himself to patrol Villaggio looking for 'inappropriately dressed' women to apprehend??
Comments please!!
Moral of the story is to respect Arabic cultures and Police should have their ID. Lets look at the two sides of the story.
Where to buy Smart sim
first,,, we are in moslem country we should respect the culture here,, second,, Yes they will catch you if you wear short dress specially thursday,, family day,,, it is to give respect to the ladies who covered their body,,, third,,, its winte now,, why you need to wear short dresses
first,,, we are in moslem country we should respect the culture here,, second,, Yes they will catch you if you wear short dress specially thursday,, family day,,, it is to give respect to the ladies who covered their body,,, third,,, its winte now,, why you need to wear short dresses
madam your country and this country is entirely different we follow islamic law and we think the person who doesnt cover him/herself is still living in a stone age society. covering in islamic country is a must and if u want to stay here u should respect the country's law.
there are some references which i would like to show
please read carefully.
Say to the believing men that they should lower their gaze and guard their modesty: that will make for greater purity for them: And Allah is well acquainted with all that they do. ”
— Qur'an [24:30]
“ And say to the believing women that they should lower their gaze and guard their modesty that they should not display their beauty and ornaments except what (must ordinarily) appear thereof; that they should draw their veils over their bosoms ... ”
— Qur'an [24:31]
“ O Prophet! Tell thy wives and thy daughters and the women of the believers to draw their cloaks close round them. That will be better, so that they may be recognized and not harassed. Allah (SWT) is ever Forgiving, Merciful.
CID?
The only way I can attach the PDF is by creating a new post. So please go to http://www.qatarliving.com/node/281753 to see it.
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"Every adult of sound mind, should be able to choose to do whatever they want, as long as they cause no harm to others".
I know there is a sign in The Centre to dress up appropriately in the mall. I am not 100 percents sure, but i think you can find the same notice in Villagio too.
try to go to My Account and upload it as a picture in the Signature section.. I hope it will work
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“You become responsible forever for what you have tamed”. Antoine de Saint-Exupéry
I have an excellent PDF document that outlines the dress code and other 'rules' for Qatar. How do I upload it here?
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"Every adult of sound mind, should be able to choose to do whatever they want, as long as they cause no harm to others".
Off course there is a dress code of every country and short skirts are not considered a decent dress in the public.
Regarding the presentation of ID from the police officer i think he should present a police ID card but it may not be must as well. Here in Qatar a police officer is quickly recognised as they are very thin and not tall :-).
be careful next time.
hey be careful of what you are saying, mate.. I don't think my hubby is gonna like what you say about me.. specially since it's an insane nonsense.. humor is good up to some point...you have never seen my legs, and definitely will never be allowed to...they are only for the exclusive view, coz too much valuable and gorgeous... so stop saying a crap....
...and stop making your ugly comments on my every post.. find someone else for your silly barbarian exercises...
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“You become responsible forever for what you have tamed”. Antoine de Saint-Exupéry
... the HYPOCRISY in DOHA.
keep on wearin that skirt or whatever.
...they try to be conservative,,, but they keep on fishin around...
(no missiles please....)
these spider-minded people...never and ever will understand them...do they think that males will jump on ladies and rape them in the middle of a shopping mall, because of an exposure of 2 legs?? are the arabs so hungry to females, while having 3 or 4 wives at the same time??? what kind of a hunger is that??why this arab mentality is so weird?? i wish and hope they will come into the modern world as soon as possible.
swift action, indeed.
"dgoodrebel will always be the rebellious good one"
YOU ARE A VERY RUDE YOUNG GUY. Haven't you heard about respect to people older than you? Are you a typical UK guy?
"dgoodrebel will always be the rebellious good one"
Milly
Mr. Amnesia, he is a real lawyer, works here in Qatar and he just gave you the most direct answer to your questions. You can't go wrong from his point of view.
Respectfully Milly
To worst case scenario, If you need a chaperon to escort you while you wear those skirts, I would mostly be glad to assist you. I'll bring my walking cane with me, just in case of emergency.
Keep smiling and move on, Shit happens all the time. Unfortunatly you got zapp by one of those moments of life.
Take care, I'm out of this forum.
The Seven Words You Can Never Say On QL by George Carlin
Stevewhit, don't hold back - speak your mind! To have to resort to name calling shows a distinct lack of intelligence and articulation. I shall treat your comments with the contempt they deserve - ie, ignore them and you
[removed by mod and user banned]
Im sure some people here somehow admired you for your effort sharing what you can call one of the unforgotten bad experience in GCC,
Milly, its a good post anyway! I hope every women will be aware of????!
Milly, CID will always show their ID. If they refuse, they get into deep trouble.
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Mr. Q's Blog - A Qatari's view on Qatar.
Bottomline, wear something what they called "appropriate dress" to avoid any distraction or anything, besides this is Islamic Country, no matter how people saying Qatar is upgrading and turned into an open country because more expats are comin here (english people, american, australian, other people from other countries)that doesnt count and at the end of the day theyre still going to mosque and pray (Arabs)
Respect their tradition and culture, in return they will respect us more.....
Whatever lights your candle, Red Pope! I'll give you my skirt if you like, as it seems I'll never be able to wear it again anyway!!
Could Darude and I wear those Mini skirt with our hairy legs and THE CID Police check my ID?
:)
The Seven Words You Can Never Say On QL by George Carlin
when CID would start intercepting girls in Abayas and giving them lectures about appropriate wear...
I have seen a number of them that leave nothing to the imagination....
"if you don't like the heat... get out of the kitchen... but stop trying to fan the flames before you leave... it will burn you on the a** as you go through the doorway...." ME
visit www.qaws.org
Tallg, it was above the knee, which I now realise some people find offensive. However, in no way would I describe it as a mini or pelmet!
Sometime CID officer doesn't allowed to show their IDs in Public. Ofcourse they have different system from UK. Don't panic. Just try to wear good dress.
I like wearing skirt, no the ugly very long one, but little bit short. I don't like dirty man and ugly woman looking at me. They just jealous, giving bad eye.
What comes around, goes around....
Just think about it, she was probably trying to wade that high tide of men eyes.....
The Seven Words You Can Never Say On QL by George Carlin
Could I give you some recommendations in reference to the helm of your miniskirts. We could always converse inside my Confession Booth in full privacy :)
PS
May be the gentleman want to view better: "DA TICKING BOMB OF YOURS".. ....
The Seven Words You Can Never Say On QL by George Carlin
Out of interest milly (and you don't have to answer this if you don't want to) was your skirt above or below the knee?
Ooooh miaow miaow Kenyaqueen!!! You sure do sound like a very bitter and judgemental person.
For your information, I have lived in many different countries around the world and have always respected their customs, traditions and people. I am certainly old enough (as you and many other people have pointed out rather spitefully!) and intelligent enough to know how to dress and behave. I had, in fact,grabbed a cardigan before leaving the house so I could cover up a bit, so I am well aware of not showing too much flesh in the Mall.
It's easy in hindsight to say I shouldn't have given this guy my ID, but to be honest, I was somewhat taken aback and didn't really know what I should do, and I didn't want to make matters worse. It seems pretty obvious now that he was a fake, but at the time I wasn't sure, never having been approached like this before.
Anyway, glad it's opened up such a heated discussion. I agree with Gypsy, lesson learned. Dress conservatively (i'm not going to say appropriately, as I still consider I was) and don't go with men who have no ID and profess to be CID officers. End of story.
but the guy's action is already a REACTION. What was the root of reaction of the "CID or non_CID" guy is the perceived "inappropiate" dress of Milly. That is why, in my mind, if a real cop is called by Milly, can you imagine the actual ending? Are we to presume that the guy will be put in jail or an additional warning for Milly?
The guy is wrong, definitely for posing as CID or not showing his badge, but will a real cop see it that way?
"dgoodrebel will always be the rebellious good one"
Yes qwerty, that's the point of this thread - it was bad that someone was either posing as CID or CID refuse to show their badges.
yes i know I'm in Qatar- what i'm asking is i THOUGHT those kind of things were pretty standard; law enforcement must present id before enforcing the law. is it not the case here? if it's not, that sounds pretty fishy to me...
Gypsy for your information the dress code warning is posted on the sliding doors when you enter the malls definately can say that about Villagio..
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HE WHO DARES WINS
"dgoodrebel will always be the rebellious good one"
well if this guy was legit, why didn't he produce his badge or other id? back in Canada officers cannot actually do anything if they don't have their id and present it- they can't even do anything if they're not completly in uniform.........is it so different here random citizens can harrass whoever in an effort to police themselves?
Apparently there is MOI section called "Al Adeid"
http://www.moi.gov.qa/AlAdeid/English/AboutAladeid.html
However, they do wear badges.According to the forum, they do have the authority to interrupt what is consider inappropriate to society!
qwertyness, addressing your paragraphs;
1st - Ignorance is not an excuse, but we've already discussed and agreed that having signs at malls describing the dress code would be a good idea.
2nd - Skirts below the knee are considered appropriate.
3rd - Agreed, and that was the reason this thread was posted in the first place and has been discussed in amongst the debates over whether we should respect the culture of the land we live in.
by selling those things in such wildly assessible public spaces as the mall, you are giving defacto cultural acceptance for them. And while many Qatari's may understand that no, the super=expensive mini skirt is meant only to be worn for one's husband, many western women may just see it and say 'well gee, you can buy them at the mall, that icon of mainstream culture? i suppose it must be acceptable here'.
As well, cultural sensitivity goes both ways. I highly doubt the OP was wearing a crotch grazing micro mini- she was probably wearing a far more conservative ensemble than she would back home. she made an effort; why can't that be acknoledged that she's trying her best to blend in, and while it may not be perfect, at least the effort has been made? how short is to short? are we back to the 1950's method of skirts are acceptable if they're longer than your finger tips when your arms are held at your sides? what about pants- if I'm total covered but my jeans may as well be painted on, is that ok? The cultural rules are far to multi faceted to be picked up right away, so unless you demand that all women wear full niqab you're going to have stumbles, and frankly I thinkt hose making an effort at least should be encouraged for it. Although i do think it's ridiculous to be fussed by the length of someone's skirt.
also, police MUST have soemthing better to do than police skirt length! and if this guy wasn't a cop? HOLY SHIT THAT'S A FAR BIGGER PROBLEM THAN HOW LONG HER SKIRT IS!!
harrasment much? I'm reminded of cases in North America where people posed as cops to rape women and otherwise take advantage of them......
modesty and law of the land; to be precise.
In public, maintain dress code and at home do what ever u feel like but ensure ur doors and windows are well shut, trust all matured understand.
Don't go beyond the forum topic
Skirt CHASE ....
have reached the 3rd page, great discussion !!
Keep going ...:) Peep Peeeep ..........!!
not in public places.
"dgoodrebel will always be the rebellious good one"
Qwerty, have you ever actually seen what is worn under abayas? Or at home? How about with their husbands? Do you think that because one wears an abaya out that they are frumpy old women? The idea is for them to show off in the house, not in the mall. Why is it hypocrisy? Just because it is sold in the mall doesnt mean it is appropriate to wear to the mall does it?
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"Diplomacy is the art of saying 'Nice doggie' until you can find a rock - Will Rogers"
And those pointy shoes could put out an eye!!! Not to mention the glare of their greasy hair can be distracting and potentially blinding in the right light!
Yes, they sell bathing suits and lingerie, but they also sell short shorts and mini skirts and halter tops etc etc. Are these all meant to be worn under an abiya? I was simply pointing out the hypocrisy of this entire thing. I may as well also mention, what about men? Those tight shirt, buttons open down to there, can be quite provocative as well......why are none of them stopped?
learned from such experience....behave and dress well when u r in any GCC country. Be postive..
I am telling you frankly, you are wrong. please do not bring your country culture to here. this is a Islamic country. you should respect. the guy inquired you, if he is not a CID he done a great job. if he is a CID he has done his duty.
Azmeer Zahir
GSM +974 6572705
it depends in what country you are. Milly is not in OZ. She is in QATAR. Qatar, Mis-cat, do you know where Qatar is? What's your point in mentioning dressing manners or ways in OZ?
"dgoodrebel will always be the rebellious good one"
Mis-Cat I have been to Australia, and it is also common in the UK, US and Canada.... but you pointed something out in your post.. "in summer especially if they are close to a beach"
Hardly the same criteria as in as in a shopping mall in an Islamic country. __________________________________________________
"Diplomacy is the art of saying 'Nice doggie' until you can find a rock - Will Rogers"
You'd die if you ever went to OZ....it's common place for women to be seen wearing just bikini tops and mini skirts in shopping centers, dropping kids of to school ,going to the post office Ect.Ect. in summer especially if they are close to a beach.....
"Your born, You Live, You Die, given this premise, one can conclude since we have no control over when we are born and when we die, the only thing that matters to us should be how we live, simple really?" Mis-Cat to her philosophy Lecturer.
Remember Kyla Ebbert who was kicked off a Southwest Airlines flight, bcoz she was showing a little too much leg..(putting it mildly)..
I shudder to think what would have happened if she was flying to Doha ;);0
I remember she became a minor celebrity and ultimately made it to the Playboy centre-spread and was paid a million bucks for that..
Wishing Milly luck!!!
...Avada Kedavra..
Milly was asked by an unidentified man as presented and Milly called for a police officer to complain about this unidentified man. What do you think will be the scenario if Milly and the guy exchange "pleasantries" with the real cop.
Any ideas?
"dgoodrebel will always be the rebellious good one"
there are a lot of stores in malls that display skimpy women underwears, does it mean you can wear it in a way that it is very distinctive?
Jauntie, everybody agrees that the "ID" thing is really wrong.
What we are changing views here is more on the issue of the "root" of the actions (whether legitimate or not). Let us learn from this incident and not just let it pass on and wait 'til somebody of our member ended in an unpleasant place.
"dgoodrebel will always be the rebellious good one"
Qwerty, they sell bathing suits and lingerie also but no one expects you to wear it when you are dropping your kids off at school.
There is a time and place for everything.
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"Diplomacy is the art of saying 'Nice doggie' until you can find a rock - Will Rogers"
The other day when you were passing through the Souq at night it was cold. and the place you passed by i saw all the men sweating in this winter. Damn you are hot :D
You really are too kind XX
I also think that some posters on this thread have made some particularly tasteless and unnecessary ageist remarks regarding what is and isn't appropriate for ladies of a certain age to wear. The comments had nothing to do with which country or culture, but were just really rude, snidey remarks for the sake of it.
The whole point of Milly's thread was to inform us of what happened and to ask for our comments on THE LEGITIMACY OF THE 'CID' BLOKE.
"Shouldn't a police officer have ID?? A friend of mine was recently fined for smoking in Starbucks, and was spoken to by a CID guy who very definitely had identification. So, was he just a local guy who takes it upon himself to patrol Villaggio looking for 'inappropriately dressed' women to apprehend??
Comments please!!"
Shame of those who made nasty personal comments. And, Milly? I think you handled the slurs wonderfully! I wouldn't have been so gracious had someone suggested I was an old wrinkly, even if I am! lol
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NIL ILLEGITIMI CARBORUNDUM
well i FIND this all ironic, considering what some of the stores in that very mall are selling- short, sheer, whatever, it's a big skankfest inside some of those stores.
can anyone say hypocritical? if you REALLY didn't want people dressing a certain way, why sell it? If they're going to start regulating what people wear into the mall, they should perhaps start regulating what people can sell.
it's what you called self-discipline and adherence to what is customary to the local scene. We can not impose our own view here because everybody knows that there are a lot of gray areas to which it is open for mis-interpretations or self-serving opinions. Dressing is a cultural thing and GCC countries will not adjust to "western-style" dressing which they find very provocative!
"dgoodrebel will always be the rebellious good one"
Agreed. I think most malls have a list of guidelines now, one of which is "dress modestly" or something, but something more specific would be better.
I personally feel people should have taken the time to read up about the country they're living in, because if they had they'd know how they should dress cos it's written all over the place. But posting the dress code at the malls would certainly make sense.
How can you say this won't happen again?? If the dress code is not properly posted then it will happen all the time. Maybe next time her shirt will be too low cut, or her pants too tight, or whatever. If the guy was doing this for nefarious reasons then he could use anything as an excuse.
If that's the case then the dress code needs to be posted in the malls, so people know why they are being removed.
with ID or Not.. wear something proper so nothing like this would happen again..
but i hope this manner of questioning should be applied to all (irregardless of nationality), a bit unfair if you will be asked like this in public then later on you will see someone else walking half naked without being questioned..
[img_assist|nid=12867|link=none|align=left|width=|height=0]Nothing in life is to be feared. It is only to be understood.
No, agreed, a random guy with no ID has no right. My point was that there doesn't have to be a law before people can be removed from the mall for inappropriate dress. As we are all too aware, the mall can instruct security to remove people (or bar them entry) for whatever reasons it wants.
But as I said earlier in the thread, even if security were instructed to bar/remove people dressed inappropriately I don't think it would have much effect, because westerners would simply ignore them and they'd be to scared to do anything about it. So police/CID would probably be needed to enforce it.
This wasn't mall security asking her to leave Tallg, this was one guy, who didn't even have ID. He had no legal right to remove her.
tripping to the unknown zone of what is clear, fine line of what is acceptable dressing manner for expats (not limited to women only).
For me, I'll look it this way, maybe it was better the guy is not really a CID so he can not take our friend to the place where she will definitely not like. Because if he indeed is a CID, in this part of the world, any argument may just fall in deaf ears and you will find yourself in an unwanted situation. Just imagine......
And Gypsy, I agree with you 100 %, but that is in a normal situation, remember, we are not ..........
"dgoodrebel will always be the rebellious good one"
did i hear this lady ask,is wearing a skirt is an offence. NO. she was aking do u think he was cid,so answer her q not judge her( to those who did judge her)NO i dont think he was my dear,
Gypsy - you're right, they can't arrest you, but they can definitely remove you from the mall no probs. Just like you could be removed from a mall for unruly behaviour or whatever in the UK or Canada.
MagicDragon said ...
I totally agree with you, QS. Women running around like Milly should instantly be raped so they remember for the next time.
Are you for real???
Do you realise how disgusting a statement this is?
I agree with Gypsy also... This lady wasnt so upset about being told she was dressed innapropriatly, she was upset by the lack of ID the most.
Worst thing about all this is, if she went with this guy and something happened to her (God forbid) she would be blamed. The questions would be:
1. Why dod she go with a man she didnt know even after she asked for an ID and he didnt give it to her.
2. She went with him alone and left her son behind, and dressed like that maybe she was looking for something.
Sad but true, she will always be blamed in one way or another.
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"Diplomacy is the art of saying 'Nice doggie' until you can find a rock - Will Rogers"
You can't arrest or legally warn someone for not following "Local Custom" If Qatar wants to make actual legal laws about what we can and can not wear THEN you can pull women out of malls for wearing mini-skirts, until that day CID and the rest of the muttawahs can F- off.
leave the skirt guys...wrinkle free or not:)...the big question here is the identity of that "CID".
For instance, a very good friend of mine wears shorts very often with a tank top as well but she does not go to the mall in it.. She wears it to private parties to people's homes and to pubs/discos.. No one is going to say anything if you dress in a mini skirt and go to the Cube at Ramada or Cloude nine at Merwab..But if you wear a abaya and shela and try to enter those places, chances are you might be stopped.. So just use your common sense before going out.
wearing the short skirt AS WELL.
a lot of if's in the conversation. If she didn't wear the short skirt then none of this would have happened, in this instance the guy posing as CID.
Let's look at the root cause of the problem, where the rules/local customs are not adhered to causing unwanted repercussions
Let us not get our selves in unwanted situations.
There is plenty of info on what is deemed appropriate dress locally, also here on QL. where i am sure all the women have read and are aware of how to dress locally, and if yet they chose not to, then whose fault is it
Yes, I agree with you people generally, she should not have given the ID..I forgot that..
...Avada Kedavra..
Is really about him not showing ID....as someone has pointed out there is a security office close by and if he really was from CID this is were he should have taken her not to some other shop for translation, sounds to me like he just wanted her details..This is why I am grateful that my PRO is a captain in the police force and is number one on my speed dial...and before anyone jumps down my throat ...yes he does have permission to work as a PRO.
"Your born, You Live, You Die, given this premise, one can conclude since we have no control over when we are born and when we die, the only thing that matters to us should be how we live, simple really?" Mis-Cat to her philosophy Lecturer.
common sense and respect as gypsy said
what on earth is the women going to shopping malls in a mini-skirt????
how very insensitive...
No she wasn't, because he may actually have been CID, but what if he had insisted she get in his car, or leave the mall. It's common sense Voldemort NO ID - NO LISTEN!
Voldemort - She gave him her ID. That's pretty serious.
Got to agree with Gypsy.. Safety could be a major issue. What if she had been asked to accompnay him to somewhere outside the shopping centre..
In Saudi, the government rule was that a Mutawa , must be accompamied by a police officer in uniform and have his ID handy before approaching you..
Whilst we are all arguing / opining about this, it would be interseting to find out what the "actual" ruke is here..
You are right, but it is not as if she got into his car with him, she just went outside Carrefour, but still inside the mall..never was she personally at risk...
...Avada Kedavra..
Hopefully if enough people make a fuss when faced with this kind of situation then CID will start carrying ID.
I remember when I was a kid there were a lot of warnings to not open your doors to police officers who weren't carrying ID, because they were just people pretending to be police officers.
Yes, it's good to clarify this as it's gone a bit off topic. There are been cases like this before, where someone claims to be from CID but doesn't produce ID, and the purpose of milly's post was to warn us.
So in case anyone hasn't got the message yet; DO NOT give anything to or go anywhere with someone claiming to be an official until you have seen their ID. Any real official will have no problem showing you ID.
I support you Gypsy.. Walking away is not courage but cowardness in disguise..
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HE WHO DARES WINS
I completely disagree Voldemort, she should have insisted on ID and NOT left the mall with this man. There's a major safety issue involved in this.
i too would like to tell u
"if you have them, flaunt them;).."..but unfortunately......
anyway it was wise of you not to argue with the guy and create a scene, bcoz the question is not whether he is a CID officer or not, or whether you were actually wearing a short skirt or not, or whether you have nice legs or not;)
the question here is, as expats, do we need to land up in trouble and attract attention when we can walk away and defuse the situation...it takes courage to fight, and requires more courage to walk away from a fight..
...Avada Kedavra..
Gypsy I think you have hit the nail on the head..
Fully agree and endorse your two point common sense advice..
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HE WHO DARES WINS
MR P - people do speak out about the covering up in the UK, when it comes to schools and things.
But your logic doesn't really hold together. Qatar is a conservative country where people cover up, so it's respectful to do the same.
But the UK isn't the opposite of this - not everyone goes round UNcovered. People wear what they want, so if people cover up or not is their choice.
I think the lesson from this thread would be that people should use some common sense.
Common Sense issue number 1: Don't leave the mall with a man you don't know, even if he says he's CID!
Common Sense issue number 2: Don't wear mini-skirts, there tacky anyway.
I dont get it MD, to be a "civilized" country you have to be able to go out of the house half dressed?
If you go to Sharjah, they have adecency act, no tank tops and shorts even for men.
You have to have your bits covered, and to be honest, no one wants to see all your stuff hanging out anyway no matter where you are. Chances are if you have a 16 year old son you may want to reconsider minis anyway.
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"Diplomacy is the art of saying 'Nice doggie' until you can find a rock - Will Rogers"
Mr P, who was going off topic
Habari lets not hijack the thread and keep with the topic.. Why did he not show his ID?
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HE WHO DARES WINS
We are in Qatar.
Mr P, Why do you always compare UK and Qatar/Gulf they are 2 totally different places. Again this thread has got nothing to do with Muslims in the UK, but you have to get in your 2 pennies worth.
Do you have a problem with the Muslims in the UK.
if you don't like the Muslims, their country or culture why don't you go back to your UK, and deal with the credit crunch.
You always seems to be whinging like a UK northerner, complaining about the Muslims, both in your numerous posts and threads that you create, which give a good indication of your nature.
What do the yobs like saying to the ethnics in the UK, if you don't like it here then go back to your countries or rather just go back to your countries
Going by your logic, what about Nuns in the UK, who dress appropriately and cover their head as well, which I don't have a problem with should they not cover up as well
" 2) BUT remember what country u are living in - respect the culture and cover up, then u won't be hassled again!!!!"
Ok fine.
But then by the same logic, Muslims in the UK should NOT cover up to respect our culture.
But can ya imagine saying that ?
And anyway, its not about her dress sense, its about the fact he didnt show any ID, and i already commented about that.
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NIL ILLEGITIMI CARBORUNDUM
I could not agree more , what they are is a bunch of ,,,,,hypocrites ,its ok for them to stare at my missus not matter what she wears
Without imagination their is nothing!
I would like to be critical of the way milly handle herself with the poor chap who had to witness her expose herself in public :) coming from a country where you often hear in the news that women are being raped & mutilated by total strangers you would really have to be abimbo and a half to actually go with a total stranger out of public site in a country where they think and treat women like second class citizens.
Milly! its very simple those people can not go to your country and behave in certain ways that they do in their own country! So, you should respect their country regardless if there is a law or not.Its all about common sense. I have been to a few muslim countries and I didn't have to look far and wide to know how to dress and behave!
The problem with people like you is that you think because you are bringing a few dollars to their country that you can do what ever the hell you wanna do and that you will get a way with it. So grow the hell up, and anyway you look a bit old to be wearing a mini skirt. Maybe the guy was offended by the wrinkle! who knows
I am always excited to go to sleep! In anticipation of the new experience I will find awaiting me.
Oh believe me, I did ask for ID, several times, but he couldn't (or wouldn't) produce any
Thanks for that voldemort - I guarantee, no wrinkled flesh ;)
every man likes a woman who wears a short skirt, as long as she looks good in it (and as long as she is not his wife;)
but again,nobody wants to see wrinkled flesh on display...you should always dress age-appropriately...
...Avada Kedavra..
next time a man approaches you like this...ask for an I.D, maybe he's just trying to play with you...take care:)
well, milly..we're in a bizzaro world....
i'm just wondrin' why most of these smurfin' CID and police officers doesn't speak english...wtf!?!?!
"The grass is always greener...over the Septic Tank"
Ha ha Red Pope!! Anyway, just to summarize. I don't consider I was inappropriately dressed. As Qatarisun so eloquently (!!??) put it - right, I'm not a teenager, therefore do not dress like one. And no, I'm not ashamed or embarrassed about my body. I get stared at no matter what I wear, believe me.
However, the REAL point of this discussion was about whether of not the guy was a genuine CID officer, and if he had any right to do what he did. It would seem not.
Obviously everyone has differing opinions, and that's the beauty of a forum like this.
Arien.. I will PM u the laws of the land...
Most of the Qataris are CIDs or behave like so..
a fake...maybe he is just a CID informer.
I agree :
1) He should have showed you his ID
2) BUT remember what country u are living in - respect the culture and cover up, then u won't be hassled again!!!!
Binu.. May we know the laws?.. what all we can wear and what not??
______________________________________________
Every society is judged by how
it treats it's least fortunates.
We are in qatar respect their laws
IMHO.. No rules are neccessary, just common sense. We are not in our home countries, we know this this "culture" , so use common sense and dress appropriately.
Anyway, this thread was about the supposed "CID" guy not showing ID, not Milly's dress sense.
you can wear anything but, for the god sake, leave the neck uncovered
he was probably complaining coz you weren't wearing fishnets or knee-high boots with the mini.
Will you dress in a tight mini skirt when you are about to visit my Confession Booth?
The Seven Words You Can Never Say On QL by George Carlin
first of all! if what you are wearing in the picture here is any indication of what you ware out in public to a family store, public store then ya, it severs you right to get stopped not just by the police but any concerned citizen! I fail to see where the real concern is because the guy asked you to follow him, he took you to another store, I am going to assume that there were other people around this big shopping centre. He took you where he could get help in conversing with you. If he had wanted to take you outside of public view, I am going to assume again that by the bold way you are dressing in a muslim country that you are bold enough to not go out of public site and given that you don't seem to be a stranger to public attention! you would have put up some kind of fuse to grab public attention. had he tried to take you out side. And if this happens again and you have another person with you don't tell them to stay put let them go with you as well!
If you have a need to show your breast or thighs off do it in your home or in a place where it is more acceptable.
am always excited to go to sleep! In anticipation of the new experience I will find awaiting me.
Qatarisum said:
You are Not a teenager yet, wearing a very short skirt in Carrefour in Qatar ggggrrrrr… must be unpleasant view…
If you wear a miniskirt make sure to wear some long socks.
I would have some issues looking down at your legs that are full of those black and blue varicose veins.
I prefer to see you dress like a run away nun....
The Seven Words You Can Never Say On QL by George Carlin
About your comments ... easy okay ... show some respect.. you have a point discuss it, sarcasm leads no where.
I’m an Arab and a Muslim too. And if we are talking about westerners here, well I see every day how they dress and act, and honestly I see them paying more attention and respect and care about the Qatari culture and traditions than many Arabs from my country or other Arab countries. Most of Arabs who didn’t live in gulf countries before need to adjust to the new environment and the different customs, habits and culture. And for sure adjusting to this is even harder for westerners and yet I see them handle this adjustment and adaptation phase in a very careful and respectful manner. And honestly an officer of law should show some ID even if it’s not stated in law to eliminate any doubts, misunderstandings or even impersonation.
and I will not complain or ask for overtime
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What is the % that can be revealed?
How are you my friend?
I think enforcing no-dress code would be easier to explain:)
talking about dress code, some countries enforce dress code on the belly dancers. they have certain criteria among which is the percentage of boobs that can be revealed. and the officer has to take the measurements to ensure the abidance by the law. SIGH. wish I can find such a job :D
===================================== http://www.qatarliving.com/node/58409
Do they have split bottom thobes for Muttawas, so that they can run?
Alexa,
If a Muttawa is after you and you start running, how will he chase you when he has his thobe on.
Will he lift up his thobe upto the hips and bare all to chase you?
good one ;-)
Alexa ... even he was a Muttawa, he has not right to ask for her ID ? He has right to call the Cops but not to pretend like a Cop (if this is the case).... he could have faced jail term, coz pretending like a CID is a serious crime here.
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A lot of people seem to be just critisizing you on how you were dressed - when really I think everyone should be concerned about the fact that some random person made you follow you to some random shop to be given a lecture. There are MANY woman in Villagio who wear revealing clothing...so unless they were stopping a bunch of people I would be very wary of believing he was who he said. If you are expected to produce ID then they are expected to produce ID - plain and simple.
Alexa what I meant was what the heck are they trying to prove by picking on western women.. If they can't tolerate then they should be like Saudi even though I do not agree with them but at least you know where you have them...
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HE WHO DARES WINS
but something is not clear and not appropriate. mainly:
1. to enforce a dress code, it should be written clearly at the entrance.
2. the guy should present his ID before talking to any person
3. I wonder why the Villagio security guy did not play the role of enforcing the dress code. same like preventing male bachelors of certain nationaliries from going inside the mall
4. dressing what is refered to as "decent dress" does not protect females. ladies with hijab and abaya are harassed and sometimes raped (there are some recent reports about this happening in Egypt). to some guys, a female is a female whether naked or covered all over which means she is a target for their attacks.
===================================== http://www.qatarliving.com/node/58409
Alexa totally agree with you.. if there gonna sell these kind of clothes then they should give a free Abaya as well lol
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HE WHO DARES WINS
I'm glad dress code is being enforced. CID or not, - people should respect the country they are in.
But since the captain is a chivalrous man like me and have an aqualung he said what he said before.
Oh that is another good option "All women please drown and let the men swim"!
When a ship full of Arabs(men&women) will capsize in the Persian Gulf, the captain may say "All men please drown and let the women swim" because men and women are not allowed to swim at the same time.
MD-- skirt and kill.. that was too much to compare.
Not a complete dress code.. but the restrictions can be publicised for avoiding these kind of embarrasments.
At one end at the cloud9 they were meassuring the length of the skirt to find out who came with the shortest on to award them..LOL..come on
______________________________________________
Every society is judged by how
it treats it's least fortunates.
Let's just remember that this is the country that banned the public from swiming in the Aspire aquatic complex because....
men and women were swimming together.
The sin of it!
Are all Western clothing short? Do they want to save fabric?
Exactly right MD.
If all those things (alcohol, short skirts, speedos for men, Ralph Lauren polo tops, Burberry print anything) were so offensive in this culture, they wouldn't be sold to begin with.
Ban it all, I say!
The mob has spoken.
I agree with you, Alexa. They should close all the shops selling the "Western" stuff!!! (If they really were serious). Oh, yeah, they should also close the Qatar Distribution Company (if they were really serious).
No Rami, it's not like that. It should be like the normal Abaya fully covered on the upper half and tight like you mentioned. But the hemline should be above the knee. What do ya think?
oh boy long post, i got an idea, all the ladies who like to wear super mini skirt or whatever type of cloths please do but do some men a favor and post the timing of your visit to malls :)
Nah, edifis, britexpat has an American girlfriend. The Cuban shotputter was only during the Olympics. Not real. He just went for the medals.
Mini in what sense, edifis?
Tight, or short, or sheer, or what?
Do you mean like the girls who cover their hair, but allow a good six inches between their fringe and the veil?
Milly..For your information there is a Security Office in Carrefour. This office is located on the sid of the Commercial bank. Since you specifically mentioned Carrefour and from my experience I can say that he was any thing but a CID officer. May be he just a pretender. CID are not dressed in Rhobe that is too easy..
Anyway sorry to hear what you had to experience. But just a small word of advice dont give than a chance dear in the first place. This lot have not problem watching women tennis say no more but can be easily offended by western clothing in malls..
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HE WHO DARES WINS
OMG, sorry, Rami. Continue being fascinated.
Thank you, Alexa.
Yes that was Ram.
And the one falling for the Cuban Shotputter was Britexpat.
sigh! No body is interested in my mini Abaya. So much for the new innovative idea! You guys crush all hopes before I can launch my idea.
Didn't you just recently post your wedding photos on QL, Rami??
I'm a big fan of the sheer, shiny, skin tight abaya that they young girls wear in City Center on a Thursday night.
Those babies leave nothing to the imagination.
lol MD, no comment on that one... im off to bed... :P
Alexa, it is not for Qatar.
edifis, who can wear them minis? It needs a very beautiful thing, otherwise they will look stupid!
One day I hope to design the mini Abaya.
NO MATTER HE WAS FAKE OR REAL BUT U MUST RESPECT THE COUNTRY'S CULTURE AND TRADITION.
ITS THE RIGHT OF EVERY CITIZEN AND EXPAT TO SHOW CORRECT PATH TO PEOPLE IF THEY ARE DOING SOMETHING WRONG.
IN MY OPINION U WERE WRONG.
JUST THINK CAN U FIND IN SOME OTHER COUNTRY THAT A CITIZEN OF THAT COUNTRY IS TELLING TO COVERUP UR BODY????????????
I WOULD SUPPORT THAT PERSON
How about wearing mini Abayas! I mean Abayas with hemline mucho mucho abovo knee!!
good, i'll still wear skirts then....
Exactly Alexa.
This is a total non-issue.
The powers that be have gone to great efforts to ban SINGLE MEN from malls.
They do not give a stuff about women wearing short skirts, so long as some amount of common sense is applied.
If the police/government/whoever wanted to ensure people wore discreet clothing to malls, trust me - you'd know about it.
The fact is, no one much cares about this, except a bunch of dried up old prudes who have nothing better to do than 'tut tut' at women who don't have the same amount of self loathing as they do.
Yes, Alexa, but you do have a taste and you do not expose yourself. At least that's what I've seen from you.
thanks MD... i hope i can still wear them to work without getting into trouble....(yawnnnnn)... i think it's time for me to hit the sack... :(
I better don't say what I'm thinking, mj. Skirts are fine.
hope skirt would still be ok as long as they dont go above the knees...
People are from different culture and coutries .. some cover up..some walk around in bikinis back home.
Now we all are in Qatar.. whats Qatar's YES n NOs...
Why cant they have a clear guidline on all these for the foreign nationals living here????
THE DOs n DONTs
______________________________________________
Every society is judged by how
it treats it's least fortunates.
Arien, do you really think there is a need for a dress code? Shouldn't everybody have enough feeling about what is appropriate and what is not? Do we always need rules? I don't need the rule that tells me not to kill. I wouldn't be tempted to do it anyway.
that is, if he does send us an invite... eh drac? we'll bring you a bloody mary.... :P
Red skirt?
My engine is running good but is shaking badly at idle-short speed(read skirt)
We should visit him, then he could show us around, mj.
wonder if there's even electricity in caves... :P
Oh, Drac, I could have told you that there would be an electrical short cut problem. Hand pump, hand pump, man.
lol MD.... :P
Drac, I thought you were flooded. What happened?
I agree. Shouldn't living abroad be an experience, not a mini version of home? I choose to live here, not just because it's tax free but because I like the way society works, I like to feel safe, my property is safe etc. The other side to that is to respect their customs and religion. For goodness sake, the allowances made for expats here, the QDC, Garveys etc, it's not as if they ask much in return. I hope they know that it is only a limited number of expats who couldn't live here without them.
your phantasy is playing tricks with you, mj.
well MD, if you did try to wear them at villaggio, then when i see a guy in skirt, i will know it's you... ;)
may be the person was doing his duty but u should respect the law of this country------ for ur kind information this is an islamic country not a country from west
..and if I did, I wouldn't do it in Villagio, mj.
Good for you. I always wish I had stuck up for myself after the event. I bet you don't allow queue pushers either!
great move scarlett,... serves them right... :)
wear it anyway...you are coverd decently....
Had a couple of women tut tut me one afternoon and I was dressed decently, so turned around and tutted them right back, while looking them up and down..they tucked their heads and turned...
Grant me the senility to forget the people I never liked,the good fortune to run into the ones I do,and the eyesight to tell the difference.
lol thanks MD,.. as long as it's not you wearing the skirt, it's ok then... :P
jj, if it's below the knee, i see no problem with it, and you were wearing boots as well... you know, i do the same as well, i mean wearing boots along with skirt,sometimes i use tights so as not to show the legs...
mjamille, I agree, but I once wore my knee high brown leather flat heeled boots with a well below the knee skirt and women kept coming up to me and tutting. Men just stared as if I was giving out encouragement. I loved those boots but won't wear them again here!
I like modest skirts, they are sexy.
you chose the modest length to wear...
same thing jasmine2....wear what you wish to when you go out clubbing/pubbing..but to the malls where families go...use common sense and dress decently for the area you live.
Grant me the senility to forget the people I never liked,the good fortune to run into the ones I do,and the eyesight to tell the difference.
The thing is, it's not as if you can't ever wear what you like. I don't imagine for one minute that Garvey's has a dress code (they certainly don't have any other type of screening process, they let neanderthals sit at the bar) The Irish Bar at the Sheraton certainly doesn't. I wouldn't have thought the Rugby Club has either. Just don't go grocery shopping in skimpy clothes, its disrespectful and embarrassing. And cold.
personally, i see nothing wrong with wearing skirts,as i myself wear skirts to work almost all the time as i am more comfortable with it,.. but of course, it is not a short skirt but a more modest one...
now don't confuse the issue with common sense...
Grant me the senility to forget the people I never liked,the good fortune to run into the ones I do,and the eyesight to tell the difference.
rami - you're getting close to a solution. Security are told who to stop and who not to stop, so they should be informed to stop anyone in inappropriate dress from entering. Much easier to stop people at the door than go hunting them out once they're in there.
The only problem is that a lot of people would simply ignore a security guard trying to stop them and push on past them, and they'd be too sh!t scared to do anything about it.
I didn't have any questions to answer...but even if I had...that's not what I would say was the answer.
The security are there only to keep the workers out...actual security is from the police. I would venture a guess that the security guys at the doors would be terrified to even THINK about stopping an expat regardless of what they wore, due to repercussions from the expats' company when they complained. Its called deportation.
Grant me the senility to forget the people I never liked,the good fortune to run into the ones I do,and the eyesight to tell the difference.
hmm, it's a good thing i only wear skirts that reaches up to the knees, i hope it's alright.... anyway, i was wearing skirt yesterday when i went to watch a concert thankfully, it was ok... :)
This brings to mind the girl who posted that she was coming for a visit and wanted to know about what clothes to bring. Several of us commented as to what's appropriate but in the end she basically said,
Toss it, I'm bringing my short skirts.
If women are going to just ignore the guidelines because they want to wear whatever they damn well please, why should they then come onto this forum and complain about being harrassed?
Duh.
it was my first thought as well... and about the age.. as i said: Not being a teenager yet, and wearing a very short skirt in Carrefour in Qatar … must be unpleasant view…
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“You become responsible forever for what you have tamed”. Antoine de Saint-Exupéry
Scarlett,
You've inadvertantly answered your own questions.
Who do the security at Villagio, City Center etc stop at all costs from getting in to the shopping centers?
And who attact NO attention whatsoever from security?
I think we can agree that it very insensitive to dress inappropriately. But shouldn't that have been taught at home already?
lol.. MD.."Maybe age doesn't guarantee maturity?
..this IS a case, i guess...
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“You become responsible forever for what you have tamed”. Antoine de Saint-Exupéry
I was thinking the same exact thing about the avatar and being appropriate.
Grant me the senility to forget the people I never liked,the good fortune to run into the ones I do,and the eyesight to tell the difference.
True, MagicDragon...
Maybe I should replace the word "mature" with "responsible"?
Stacey, you are spot on, I was trying to think of a diplomatic way of saying JUST THAT!!!
not even 5 months ago, the government put out a notice that dress was getting too lax. They were telling the expats to watch what they wore and that there WAS a dress code and if it was still being taken for granted, that it would be enforced more stringently.
I don't know what milly wore..but for a woman to say that her skirt was "shortish" then trust me..it was definitely above her knees. I had to laugh at your comment about the door security men stopping her. The only ones they stop are the workers and that's only on Family day.You also have to remember that you are not from here and therefore have a differing opinion of what's acceptable and what's not. I have personally seen women, both young and old, wearing things that I would have been shocked to see even in the States. Some of which most definitely didn't have the body to be wearing it either! Main point is...wear what is appropriate for the country you are in and there is no problem.
Grant me the senility to forget the people I never liked,the good fortune to run into the ones I do,and the eyesight to tell the difference.
I didn't get that message from QS, it is a fact, men stare whatever you wear. I think things have change a lot over the last few years here, I was wondering if the rules had officially been relaxed. Nothing worse than middle aged men in skimpy shorts during Ramadan. Yes, maybe I am ageist, but you know who I am talking about...
Maybe age doesn't guarantee maturity?
There is signage at the entrance of Hyatt Plaza which offers a few "rules" for mall patrons (e.g. dress modestly, conduct yourself appropriately, etc.). If they aren't there already, perhaps they should be placing the same signs at the entrance to Villaggio.
Locals, or those of any nationality, have no right to take upon themselves the role of "short skirt patrol", but it seems to follow basic common sense that one would cover appropriately when it could be deemed offensive to be showing too much skin in public. As a western expat female, I am amazed at the attire that some of my "fellow" westerners wear. It demonstrates a complete lack of respect for the country in which you are a guest, for lack of a better term.
I'm also wondering when age appropriate attire starts to come into play. If you have a son that is 16, you'll be at least in your late 30's or early 40's or above. I understand some of the expat teenagers wearing something like this to the mall, but not from someone who is mature enough to know what is or isn't appropriate.
If she wore what she's wearing in her avatar it would be inappropriate for Qatar.
My point is that no one saw what Milly was wearing, so perhaps it's a bit too hasty to assume that she was wearing anything that could fall into the 'inappropriate category'.
Don't just assume because it was, as she says, a 'shortish skirt' that it was necessarily inappropriate.
And don't also assume that 'covering up' is enough.
But ultimately, the point remains that it is the place of the police, not concerned mullas, to enforce these sorts of laws. If it was fine for her to get through the security at all the shopping center entrances, I wouldn't think for a second she was dressed 'inappropriately', no matter how you chose to term it.
And if the police are to enforce this, they should do so with the assistance of identification.
I totally agree with you, QS. Women running around like Milly should instantly be raped so they remember for the next time.
went to the souq the other night in a top that was a bit lower than it should have been...felt unconfortable all evening and kept pulling it up higher...not that I normally wear things like that, but was going out dancing afterwards and didn't have time to go back home to change...from now on I will take a shawl!
Grant me the senility to forget the people I never liked,the good fortune to run into the ones I do,and the eyesight to tell the difference.
rami... not everything is measured by law.. or even by rules.. how about using common sense? how about respecting the country which YOU have come to, not other way around? how about your own feelings and senses? .. as I said.. I fell so much uncomfortable going to the place overloaded with men of all types, I often do wear abaya..there is no law saying that i must wear abaya..it is just my feeling, not to attract unnecessary attention of men of all types...
I am still wondering how come milly, you really never feel that men actually stare at you when you wear a short skirt? really, just wondering...
when i wear some tight top, and I have to pass by some group of men sitting on the street and waiting for their bus, i feel like in hell...when their 10-15 pairs of eyes following me, when their heads turning in unison as one, checking every inch of my body I wish i would be covered from the nose to the toes..
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“You become responsible forever for what you have tamed”. Antoine de Saint-Exupéry
Iwouldn't be here if it were. Its too restrictive.
HOWEVER...everyone should have enough respect of the nationals and their sense of dress to abide by what they know to be right.
As far as how many inches on a Qatari man in a high wind..then I say congrats to his wife!!
And on the tight shirts...well again, poor judgement on the women's part...
Grant me the senility to forget the people I never liked,the good fortune to run into the ones I do,and the eyesight to tell the difference.
The CID has plenty of work to do then. (If he cared)
good points..
Grant me the senility to forget the people I never liked,the good fortune to run into the ones I do,and the eyesight to tell the difference.
This isn't Saudi, kids. And you were in a shopping center, not a 5 star hotel or a mosque.
We've all seen Qatari men wearing thobes on a windy day. You don't need to look closely to count the inches.
And how many women wear long sleeve, skin tight shirts, revealing their cup size?
Or wear skin tight jeans, so tight you can see their preferred cut of underwear?
OHH if only we had a rule for men like that..I'd be more than happy to offer to inforce it for free!!!
rami-leb...I don't know where you are from, but before I came to this country, I was WELL briefed on what to wear and what NOT to wear. It was made VERY clear that skirts and shorts are not to be above the knee, as well as no sleeveless tops, low cleavage or belly showing. come on, common sense tells us that when you are in a country that is Muslim, you try your best to abide by the rules or suffer the potential consequences.
You probably weren't on here when a lady wrote in to tell of how a covered woman came up to her and said that her top was too tight and inappropriate...the lady in question was pregnant...the covered woman said her husband was CID and she was going to report her...No there is no written law for dress code..but respect, common sense and knowledge need to be used when living in a foreign country.
Grant me the senility to forget the people I never liked,the good fortune to run into the ones I do,and the eyesight to tell the difference.
Apart from anything else it's freezing in Villagio, I always take a cardi. I have no sympathy whatsoever for expats who complain about the locals. Go home and pay tax.
Saying that it isn't a law isn't an excuse! If you wore a bikini round a shopping mall in the UK I expect you'd be asked to leave and dress more appropriately in the future. It's not a law, just like it isn't here.
But it's a question of respect for the country you're in. This is a conservative country, so dress accordingly. It's written all over the place that you should cover up.
I'm not sure who else was in Villagio but everyone here seems to be totally convinced that Milly's skirt was inappropriate.
Depending on your point of view, any skirt could be too short. That's a matter of personal taste.
I think that anyone with half a brain knows what is 'too short' and what could be considered by some mutawa as being 'too short'.
The fact is, there is no LAW that says that your skirt should be of a certain length. If the Qatari legal system wants to legislate to cover the length of your skirt, they could and would do so.
So I think the whole 'inappropriate' line of argument is just personal prejudice masquerading as legal fact.
Milly you were fortunate that this guy pretending to be CID just had a few quiet words to you and that was it. The last time someone posted on here about having a run in with a 'CID officer' he had his wallet stolen.
Does point 1 apply to men, too, Scarlett? I can see lots of inappropriately dressed men in the malls. Fat bellies swelling out of tight t-shirts, hairy legs sticking out of short shorts, and so on. It is really disgusting, even though I'm not a mullah.
two points that are revelant here..
1) you were inappropriately dressed for Doha. You, as an expat, should KNOW that skirts are not to be higher than your knee. Doesn't matter how often you wore the skirt..it was still wrong.
2) The guy should have shown you his ID, IF he actually had one...I don't care WHERE you are, never go with someone who tells you they are police, because they might not be and then you are at their mercy, as Xena said. I would think that in a country such as Qatar, that they would have FEMALE CID officer to deal with such issues NOT male. I mean geez, even at the airport they have females doing all interactions with females.
Makes you wonder tho if the supposed CID officer and the shopkeeper weren't in kahoots together...playing the old "let's scare the bejesus out of an expat" game...
Grant me the senility to forget the people I never liked,the good fortune to run into the ones I do,and the eyesight to tell the difference.
if he was CID (Which i doubt), he would've wore a badge. MOI emplyees on duty must wear badges.If you encounter this situation again , go to the MOI stand (there is one in every mall).
So, by law, must an officer show his id or not?
"In any civilised country". That's exactly it, Rami.
I thought dressing appropriately were passé.
wearing micro mini is hot, if youve got the legs......
s-m-i-l-e
Personal taste in clothes is just that.
Unless and until some official law is passed outlawing skirts of a certain lengths, or necklines that plunge too far, then surely people should be able to wear 'shortish skirts' without fear.
I have great difficulty believing that this guy was a police officer. In any civilised country the first thing an officer of the law would do when addressing someone is show some form of identification. His inability to do so makes me think he wasn't a police officer, just another busy-body trying to stick his nose in where it doesn't belong.
Milly if I were you I'd wear that skirt as much as you please.
You don’t come to the important business meeting with the track suit. You don’t come to the GYM with the high heels. You don’t go to the night club wearing nun dress or abaya. You don’t (at least shouldn’t) put a full night make up and evening garment while going to the fish market on Friday morning to get some fish for the dinner… One has to have a sense of style, of what is suitable to the certain situation and what isn't.. you should take few lessons in this field I guess…
and again. it doesn't not matter who the man was.. it's not about the man! it is about yourself...
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“You become responsible forever for what you have tamed”. Antoine de Saint-Exupéry
What's more inappropriate - wearing a short skirt or pretending to be a police officer?
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NIL ILLEGITIMI CARBORUNDUM
milly, i don't see how showing the ID would change the matter.
Aren't you aware that the way you are dressed is inappropriate? You should have a sense of style, since you are Lady, ‘specially an English Lady. You obviously don’t! It is inappropriate to go to Carrefour in Doha wearing a short skirt. Period.
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“You become responsible forever for what you have tamed”. Antoine de Saint-Exupéry
The old saying - "Whe in Rome, don't be a Christian"..
Nuff said..
I have was once stopped by CID person and the first thing he did was to show me his ID.
He should have showed his ID to prove who he was. Simple and obvious I would have thought. And I never said he yelled at me. And is some random shop the right place to take me?? Hmmm, I think not
policeman......See how far that would get me.
Police are not exempt from the laws, even though they might think so.
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NIL ILLEGITIMI CARBORUNDUM
You say, you've worn this skirt MANY times before…
well.. too bad for you …too bad, you have never noticed how other people, including expatriates are dressed up.. too bad, you don’t feel a “black sheep” while wearing a short skirt in such public place overloaded with men of all types.. Don’t you feel uncomfortable when guys stare at you , and I am sure they do… I think one has to get familiar with the region where he/she is going to live, and kind of try to respect the traditions of this region… And it doesn’t matter who the man was.. even if he was not a policemen, you should have taken it in a different way….I would feel ashamed… I could undrstand you go to the night club, that's fine...but...Not a teenager yet, wearing a very short skirt in Carrefour in Qatar ggggrrrrr… must be unpleasant view…
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“You become responsible forever for what you have tamed”. Antoine de Saint-Exupéry
if its a policeman his name is already there on his pocket.
Paul UK is UK Qatar is Qatar, each have thier own rules.
May be you can get away with that in UK, here you could be in trouble for insulting an officer on duty. SImple isnt it.
I am curious about the law here. The reason why police shows id in other countries is usually due to the law stating that they must. Can anyone enlighten me if there are similar laws here?
If some wierdo came up to me in the UK and claimed to be a copper, he would have got told the same as well........
Too many mad mullahs here.
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NIL ILLEGITIMI CARBORUNDUM
why should the CID show his ID anyway?
BTW he didnt yell at you. He took you to a place where someone could explain to you rpoperly what he wanted to convey to you. Then whats the problem anyway.
When in Rome.....I don't see the issue..if you were appropriately dressed in the first place the situation probably wouldn't have arisen. shock! Horror! Didn't speak English....perrrlease why the hell should he?.....
Oh I didn't know I can edit...made a grammatical error. Still early here :-)
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Veni, Vedi, Visa ~ I came, I saw, I shopped
What about the shopkeeper? Why did this supposed CID (what does that stand for anyway?) officer go to that specific shopkeeper, and not the security office in the mall? Was he in on it or something?
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Veni, Vedi, Visa ~ I came, I saw, I shopped
Without going into any longwinded dialogue with anybody who claims to be CID etc it is the best policy to ask for their ID, if they claim not to understand then get somebody to translate for YOU, remain calm . This is so common,yet could have dreadful consequences.
STAY SAFE.
who ever he was dont u think so he has protected u from any type of danger and the site of some bad men and guys and moreover this is an islamic country were such type of dressings are prohibited.be thankful insted of doubting.
LOL, Milly!!..."an officer tasked with apprehending inappropriately dressed women"
I believe their duties are not confined to the above task alone. They might be handling a lot of things which can include the one said above.
Yeah, I do have a feeling he might have been a fake CID.
Absolutely right Britexpat. That was the bit I didn't like. The more I think about it, the more convinced I am that he was fake.
Glad to hear that you are OK.. That's the main thing..
The main issue to me is not that they wanted to enforce a dress code (That is their right), but that the guy did not have identification.
Well, Should a visitor or an expat learn the laws from experience ?? Or should be made aware in advance atleast on the DOs and DONTs??...if so where is all these written??..
AND Unawareness of law is not an excuse!!!!!!!
If there is more?.. where do I find them. I need to know. Cause I am against breaking the rules.
Let them be clear on what they want and what they dont want and publicise it. So those who jumping in could decide to take it or leave it.
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Every society is judged by how
it treats it's least fortunates.
Winn I take your point about not speaking English and I agree it would be unusual for a PC in the UK to speak Arabic. I just thought it strange that he didn't speak any English, that's all. Most people here can at least speak a few words, and if he was a CID officer tasked with apprehending inappropriately dressed women (most of whom will probably be Western and English speaking I guess?) I think it's reasonable to assume that he would have been chosen because of an ability to communicate and speak some English
my neighbour told me that one day when she was parking her car a man came over to her and said it was HIS parking space and he was a policeman.
There are no allotted spaces in our car park and he eventually admitted he wasn't with the police. (I think he may work for a Government Ministry or similar, but he's definitely NOT a policeman)
Some strange people around who wish to enforce their own laws on others.
Mandi, you're right - I wished afterwards that I'd insisted on seeing ID, or a uniformed police officer. However, hindsight is a wonderful thing!
but if I was you, I would have asked him for his ID before you followed him out of the shop... he could have lead you out of the mall and into danger.
I have discovered that many locals tell you they are police, CID or ISF, just to get your nervous and scared. I insist on ID before believing them. Your safety is at risk if you don't.
"if you don't like the heat... get out of the kitchen... but stop trying to fan the flames before you leave... it will burn you on the a** as you go through the doorway...." ME
visit www.qaws.org
Well, you are in Qatar not in UK or US, so IMHO, your not knowing arabic is more of an issue than the CID's not knowing English.
Would you expect a constable in UK/US to talk to a guy in arabic coz that guy was from the middle east?
Also, you might steal many times, but just coz you were not caught doesnt mean you were right to steal. (Well, I do understand the comparison between inappropriate dressing and stealing is a bit off the mark).
And no, 'Inappropriate dressing' is not quite a matter of opinion if you read it in context with the part of the world you are in.
Yeah, I do agree with you on the ID part. He should have been carrying his ID.
You are right, tallg, there are two issues here. We would all agree that dressing conservatively is the wiser choice. But I would be VERY uncomfortable being approached by a stranger who "said" he was a police officer but offered no ID and did not wear a uniform who wanted to take me somewhere in order to make personal comments about my attire and behavior. If I had my wits about me at that point I think I'd insist on a uniformed woman police officer being called.
Mandi
milly, if that happens again you should immediately call the police. There are a lot a "fakes" running around in Doha.
Perhaps it's the Ugly ;)
So, what is it? Good or bad?
OH No.....
well thats bad news about starring for me :P lol
Im the one and only
GOOD - they're clamping down on inappropriate dress
BAD - the people clamping down have no ID and don't speak English
They sell alcohol in Doha, too, but it would be inappropriate to drink a bottle of beer in the Villagio.
Inappropriate dress is surely a matter of opinion?? As I said, I've worn this skirt MANY times before with absolutely no problem at all. Incidentally, it was bought here in Doha too!
This guy only wanted to protect you from too many bachelors staring at you.
Well, the moral of the story is....not to dress innapropriately!