Brit expatriates earn double....

When someone has nothing to say then they say either accept it or leave it :) To me it is funny as nobody here is saying that they are unhappy with their salaries. They are happy and that’s why they are working here.

The argument is not about being happy or not. The argument is the difference of salary between different nationalities. I don’t know why people are having wrong perceptions.

There was one unhappy Indian who has already left the country for good and working in some other country. So people stop quoting the same guy over and over. If you don’t understand something then don’t mix it up.

Difference between salaries do become frustrating for some people based on nationalities but to me it is understandable as it depends on the salary back home and COL back home. Nothing else.

So stop making wrong perceptions that who is better then whom. Most people are getting good salaries according to their situation and that’s why they are here.

I have mentioned before that I am happy with my employer and with my salary too but I made mistake during job interviews that I did not negotiate my salary at all because of my wrong perception of COL in Qatar. When I came to know about this mistake I talked to my employer and they have fixed my salary. It was easier for me and for them as they have seen my work and appreciate it. This is why they are giving me good upgrade even under the current economic recession.

People stop bragging or complaining and get back to work.

The people who get jobs here are not poor, when they are in their own countries now that is poor. Its more than poor its destitute. Its not the responsility of the gulf countries to improve the standard of living in Pakistan, India or where ever. They are here to run a business and if you get offered a job that doesn't pay enough, don't come its simple. If you are not happy with your own salary in your home country complain to your government don't blame people in other countries for your plight....

I will take another citizenship preferable a brit to have those previleges.

guys if u dont get paid as u expected..so thats it game over ..go back home....is that the solution????

think hard..

***~~~~DR.XRAY~~~~***

In fact I did a lot for the low paid when I was in Qatar.

But I hate the greediness of some.

The "I don't understand" is funny.

I suggest that you stick to your IT and don't try to understand C&B!

Dweller, You are certainly not born to understand the plight of poor people. Forget it dude.

You don't understand that a manager also holds the responsibility that his worker eats,sleeps and has sex...just not to fill his own....

Why to hit on the earning individuals?? its the company who has a policy to pay on what they feel fair scale. if a company feels and favours brit/american's for a post, so be it. whats the big deal. and why to compare the salary at first place, if you are satisfied with your pay you stay if not you have every freedom to go back to your home country. so lets be happy on what we get and give our fullest ethically.

these comparison would only bring downfall and dejection.

life is short and highly unreliable,live to the fullest... :-)

Shyams

The salary reflects the value of the job to the organisation. If the labourers cannot fill their needs on a salary of QR 600 then why come.

If the organisation start losing staff, who is to blame and should take the stick (certainly not the labourers). If the organisation isn't profitable who takes the stick?

Do the labourers have things on their meind when they finish work everyday? I doubt it.

If they can't manage on QR 600 then they either shouldn't have accepted the offer or need to move. If they could save as much in their base country then go back.

Private organisations have to make a profit, QP don't, that's why the pay in QP is so much better than in the private sector (but only in some fields)and is also the reason for Qatari national staff being reluctant to work in the private sector.

On the topic of the survey itself. I think enough people have commented on the size of the average salaries being quoted and I for one don't believe them. I doubt if the figures have been confirmed.

disagreement whatsoever. I believe 'counterparts' means equal designation, equally qualified to the position, but sad to say, not equal in remuneration. However, it is an individual prerogative to accept the offer or not, if he did so, then no reason for whining or complaining. The survey only said of GCC respondents, I'm sure you can read different results if done in the western countries.

"I do live by the motto that pessimists are usually right, but all the great change in history was done by optimists" -Thomas Friedman

johnjo liveing and loveing life

Maybe the brits are just better than there counter parts !!!!!!

What else you expect from a truck driver or laborer :)

Do whatever the supervisor says. No decision making is required at this level.

An owner wants his driver to follow orders.

My sponsor told me many years ago, the only reason that westerners are employed is that their job is not the whole focus of their life. If something is wrong they will say what they think by and large, and leave for another job elsewhere if needed. His attitude was that for many other nationalities their job was the whole focus of their, and their families lives. Indeed many had borrowed money or sold the farm to come here,where they expected to earn megabucks, and some did. However jeapordising this by opposing the boss did not come into the equation at all. How would you pay someone whose advice was not always impartial. I remember when a lorry tailgated a car at the Ramada signals, the sub-continental driver apologised saying he knew that the brakes were faulty but his boss had told him to drive anyway. In life you get what you pay for, peanuts and monkeys sprong to mind!

I agree what you said about the labor salary.

Everybody has reasons to live aboard, some for money while some for other reasons. Mostly people are here for money and everybody is paid more than what they would back home. Thats why they come here.

I too find it disgusting that these poor men are paid such low salaries. All the hours they work and the disgusting living conditions. It is horrible.

The thing is there was always been a 'them and us' culture all over the world and there probably always will.

There are always going to those that are paid more than others. I agree though 60,000 for the boss and 600 for the man that breaks his back in the baking sun all day is harsh and hard to swallow.

Is this slave labour? Or just a general market force? Some people are so desperate to leave grinding poverty behind for something (albeit low salary in our eyes)that is better for them.

We are all here for various reasons, some just for the money.

I think on the whole, those of us that are paid are generally better of here than back at home.

My thoughts are my own, but I doubt my Mum would agree with some of them.

Dweller, I know a manager here whose CTC is QR60000 and his labor's is QR600. Do you think this is justified just for bearing some responsibility. And we say they shouldn't greed. they can hardly fulfill their needs with this meagre salary forget about the greed. this huge gap is the reason the poor remain the poor while the rich become more rich.

And what you said about the QP employees is right. And those outside of QP assigned similar duties, take home much lesser. What about this injustice? Lets not discuss racism but look at the gaps in salaries.

it has a LOT to do with 'disposable income'.

Why else would we all (apart from the adventure of it all) go running to the likes of Saudi and Iraq if it was only to complain about the climate and religious constrictions.

Oddly enough, QP paid the same to all nationalities and may well still do but using the WIA and apparently now also other allowances to differentiate.

Historically (1985 era), Western staff in Qp were earning 15% less than their equivalants in such as Shell in the UK (after tax). They (QP) couldn't figure why turnover of Western staff (39% a year) was so high.

Asian (using Indian as an example) staff faired relatively much better as their disposable income was 12 times what it would have been had they been working in India. We had a Senior Clerk who was very proud of his home. So would I have been, massive pillars at the entrance, a great deal of marble and a very nice large pool. He also owned a shopping mall that his sons managed.

Good for him I say but don't bleat because it may not be happening in other companies.

"...Employees from the UK who took part in our poll during January told us they earned an average of nearly $14,500 a month including all bonuses, commission and allowances... "

It's the allowances!!! aka accomodation and car which add up.

You get what you 'contract for' ergo you get what you think you want and go for the job.

Why then bitch about it after the event. If it's so well known that Westerners get paid more, then the Asian knows that when applying for the post.

I agree it's unfair, but in your home country you are tempted to earn more overeas aka ME and it takes more to tempt a european or an american than it does to tempt an asian! It's not rocket science.

We all take home more money than we would earn at home. that's why we work here.

I'm NOT 'here' at the moment, and will surely miss the income.

Enjoy it whilst you can, my friends. Don't spend it all at once because one day you MAY have to go home.

I've no idea where they got their figures from ... hub is an old trooper around the ME since forever (qualified bloke and all that) and there's no way he's ever earned that salary quoted for a Brit. I wish!

Were they quoting per annum?

Well I might be leaving soon . I took this article to my HR manager and demanded that he raise my salary sufficiently so as to come into line with the figures stated. He thought for a moment and told me exactly what I could do wit the article - Painful, but doable :(

Westerners will always be paid more than, (said it the other day and got insulted), third world people.

I am saying THIRD WORLD, just because it is easy and can't be arsed googling the politically correct statement.

We will always be paid more, as the perception is, we are better in some way.

Don't ask me where this perception came from.

In my mind it is wrong.

Hope I managed to get my support across without being misinterpreted as racist.

My thoughts are my own, but I doubt my Mum would agree with some of them.

Wish i had a job to bitch about salary etc !!

I just popped into the kitchen and was looking over jaunties shoulder (and her new laptop)..................

come and look at this lot said she.

I guess you get's paid for what you 'contract for'..............i.e what you think you are worth

Stop bitching and get on with it or leave..... go back home if you can do better there :D

I can understand your feeling as the same thing has happened to me in past.

These oil companies have buckets of money to waste so you can expect anything from them.

Operating companies does not require engineers in such heavy numbers.

we are talking labourer level here.

but who's to say that man/woman is not intelligent but just uneducated and may have a point?

I have been the victim of somebody from another country being my boss who was not as qualified as me.

It sucks.

I hated it. I tried to be understanding, but with every mistake they made I cringed.

My thoughts are my own, but I doubt my Mum would agree with some of them.

It varies from case to case basis. Some are on par with western qualified people because of their knowledge, experience and ability while some are below par. There are some who got education from good universities in UK & US (including myself) with high CGPAs (even higher than their westerner friends)

I would still say that it depends heavily on negotiation skills, awareness about cost of living.

If world believe that any westerner is better than an Asian then we all know there are so many myths looming around and this is probably one of them. People are born genius & intelligent, yes education does help in polishing skills but you don’t have to be westerner to get quality education.

Yes, you are right that feeling of getting paid less considering you are as qualified as your peer is not a good feeling. This would rip apart your job satisfaction etc. So again, I would say that aim for something which is best for you rather than comparing with someone else.

It may be injustice but having been in C&B for over 40 years I see it as greed.

It may be a bitter pill to swallow but that's how it works, accept it. look at ARAMCO, they have US pay scales and UK pay scales the latter being considerably lower than the US scales. Some of the Brits complain but the same argument applies as I originally stated.

blablabla

If jobs were graded purely on physical effort yes I would agree. However, looking at the total job then no.

What damage (by making a decision) could a labourer cause?

"They pay for what you DO, not what you KNOW. The exceptions may be in jobs involving advanced research."

Don't you think then dweller most labors' income should surpass that of managers here!

I don't think it is greed but a sense of injustice.

These people come over here, and they are, they suppose as qualified as 'Westerners', however, the rest of the world, deems they are not.

That must be a bitter pill to swallow.

I don't know if they are or not, not in that business but I can imagine being really hacked off if I thought I was as qualified as my peer but getting less money.

My thoughts are my own, but I doubt my Mum would agree with some of them.

This sort of topic has been discussed time and time again.

Any company will rarely if ever pay you purely for what qualifications you have. Education is one of many factors in all job grading schemes. They pay for what you DO, not what you KNOW. The exceptions may be in jobs involving advanced research.

In respect of salary levels and as many others have stated, it's all about disposable income, what it is perceived that each nationality requires and more importantly establishing a level of remuneration that will attract and retain the required level of staff.

Why should one nationality have a disposable income 20 times what he could expect if he worked in his base country when another nationality would have a disposable income only 20% greater than he would if he worked in his base country.

It all boils down to economics. No employer is going to pay more than he has too.

Invariably people are happy with what they originally accept........until they realise what others earn and that's when greed kicks in.

Yes, saad, luck doesn't favor all. The same people who moan would defend if they had their coveted job! This is rather a land of luck.

Otherwise sky is the limit.

For all those who complain stop comparing yourself with others as they say that you humilate yourself the moment you start comparing yourself with someone.

The secret of happy living is that always focus on what is good for you based on your needs rather than comparing with others.

Yes, I was talking about DESS but I wrote the wrong abbrevation.

Anyways, I dont care anymore about DESS after that. So I dont even put my kid on the waiting list of DESS.

Every school has some positives and some negitives. Hopefully I would find something better for my child.

I wrote about school because someone mentioned about schools just before my post.

Yes, correct. No one is forcing anyone. This is what I also say to people who complain about the Qatar being boring, expensive, not good place to live etc etc.

I am not saying anything about your long thread at all. I was commenting on your P.S.

If you go back to my post then you would find me saying that I am happy with what I am getting. I know the post is long but please take time and read it completely. I am not complaining about anything. There is no point in complaining when you have accepted something. Also complaining on QL would not help a single peny rather one should complain in front of boss if he feels that he is not compensated properly. I know some asians complain about it and in my post I was trying to convey the reasons behind this. I was just adding my 2 cents. The higher cost of living does not necessarily means higher standard of living. Qatar is one example of it and in some cases western countries too where an average guy is paying too much for living but not getting the quality. It varies from case to case. An average individual is just surviving & he is mearly a part of money circulation process.

I agree with your comments on, I presume DESS? There are a lot of kids leaving, so you may get lucky.

I appreciate as it is a 'British School' they admit British kids first.

From first hand experience though, they do not even accept British kids sometimes.

Don't be too upset. As we say in England, 'every dog has its day' and DESS are not the powerhouse they presumed they were.

Getting back to the original thread, I agree with exile. We all get presented with contracts, we all sign them.

Live with what you agreed on.

and the comments afterwards I would say to my Asian friends, if you are not happy with the package offered why do you come in the first place? It seems stupid to me to complain afterwards when you have signed on the dotted line. I'm assuming no one forced you.

The more disappointing thing I found about schools is that they at times tend to favor western expat's kids in admissions. I was told by DESK, which is at walking distance from my apartment, that there is no place for new kids who are supposed to join in sep 2009. When I said that this is January and how come you don’t have any place available for sep 2009? The lady told me that if you have British passport then come and I would take your kid. This is the most ridiculous thing that I have heard so far.

First of all, I believe the survey figures are not correct. I agree that people from countries like Pakistan, India etc accept jobs on less salary. There are usually two reasons for that, first; the cost of living in their country of region is not as high as western countries although at times they enjoy better life style back home as compared to an average person from western world and interestingly at much lower cost.

The second reason why at times they accept lower salary is that sometimes they do not have fair idea of cost of living being so high for a place like Qatar. Life style in Qatar is by no means comparable to the cost of living in Qatar. For example I am paying QR 8,000 for a pathetic 2 bedroom apartment which is same as six month rent of the similar apartment in KSA. How someone like me who was switching job from KSA to Qatar can imagine such high rental prices. Ofcourse I visited Qatar Living before switching job and try to get fair amount of idea for cost of living in Qatar but unfortunately cost of living is relevant thing. Something expensive for someone can be cheaper for another person. So I perceived the wrong cost of living in my mind and made the decision of switching job. There are no photographs available online for rental apartment so one cannot access it until he is here and see with his own eyes. One cannot trust the employer supplied cost of living figures. This is true for people from low cost of living background as compared to people from higher cost of living backgrounds. People from US & UK ask for more salaries because they based it on their cost of living back home which is somewhat comparable to Qatar. By the way I can rent a really nice two family house in Pakistan for the amount of rent I am paying for the place I am living in. I have been to New York, where I done my masters and I know I can get a house on bank loan in the amount I am paying for my place in Qatar. It is just like draining money in the sewer. My sister is in NY too and she has her own house (mortgage) in Hicksville and paying similar amount to the bank every month. I do not have any regrets as I am quite content with what I am earning (better than majority and more importantly good enough for me) and I was the one who accepted this offer although I was ignorant of the correct cost of living in Qatar. I am just trying to convey the message. It is just a thought which at times comes in my mind that I could have been negotiate better had I know the correct COL. Without having the same baseline of comparing salaries between nationalities such surveys are useless. I have seen people from Pak and India earning salaries similar to western expats. The point is that you should know your market value, cost of living of target country and salary range for similar positions. After that, it all comes down to salary negotiation where I would give more marks to western expats as they really know how to negotiate the salaries well.

LIVING IN QATAR

Is Hitler born in Qatar?

Hasn't anybody noticed the discrimination in school fees? I recall that when I was paying QR2,000 a month per child (I hear it is a lot more now) an Indian I knew was upset because his school fees were going up to about QR160 a month.

What about the discrimination in house prices? When I was trying to find QR300,000 to buy a small house in a lousy area in Britain, Indian developers were over here trying to tempt their compatriots to buy into "paradise" developments for about QR30,000 or so, if I remember the adverts correctly.

If Brits can be persuaded to work for Indian salaries I have no doubt that the Qataris will be delighted to oblige. When I was trying to recruit a couple of Brits I simply couldn't find anybody who would take the wages the firm was willing to pay for Westerners - which at that time was about 50% more than Asians were getting.

Eaglemmanuel, "there's a general lack of critical thinking"

That's an UNDERSTATEMENT!

Eaglemmanuel,

Thank you!

Perhaps salaries do vary, but on what you well pointed out (general lack of critical thinking)!

I think its more foolishness than racism to blame for the discriminations in the jobs here. Most employers have no assessment/appraisal policies in place and worstly they have no interviewing skills at all. They measure all westerns with the same scale and all asians with the same scale...etc..

Generally agree with Lusitano and with respect to, "The article’s title was taken from the mishandling of the data, either by ignorance or by malicious intentions to provoke polemic (to sell)."

Partly the latter but most probably, the former. There is a general lack of critical thinking because they have not really learned it yet. They don't know how to do a proper research and qualify the use of the data and its interpretations and because of that, the research does not carry much weight, as you guys have all pointed out.

/There is a proper term for these qualifications - eg. sample size, etc... but I've forgotten, as it's not relevant to my work. No spare time to search and dig it up though I know where to look.

*****************************************

Don't want no drama,

No, no drama, no, no, no, no drama

there is a very good saying that people should remember

"There are lies, then there are dam lies, and then there are statistics"!

nicaq25,

He compared the average salary of all British who answered the survey with the average salary of all Indians who also answered the survey.

Because of the diversity of grades is greater among Indians than Brits and the distribution among those grades is not equal between those two nationalities, the analysis of the Survey data can NEVER be accurate unless the comparison is done between nationalities AND within the same job grade.

The article’s title was taken from the mishandling of the data, either by ignorance or by malicious intentions to provoke polemic (to sell). Considering the quality of journalism in this region, I suspect the second scenario did take place!

when I first read the article. Reading along the paragraphs, as one commented on that website, the title thus implicate other meaning as it should not only be compared to Brits but westerners, otherwise it sounded differently to readers. However, the article was already there, their survey report said so and being a reader, we can only comment and give our opinions. Unless, this issue (salary grades) could be considered by authorities/officials concerned and give emphasis or being look into. But I doubt it.

"I do live by the motto that pessimists are usually right, but all the great change in history was done by optimists" -Thomas Friedman

Brit Expat earns the double that Indian Expat..

Really i did not know that...

-----------------

HE WHO DARES WINS

pennypitstop,

I have explained b4 that the journalist compared apples with oranges and that is wrong as it distorted the data.

Accuracy would have been applied if he had compared within the same job title, salaries from the different nationalities, which he didn’t!

The lack of understanding of how the data was misused and how most readers felt in the trap set by the journalist (with a malicious intention just to sell), is perhaps a reason why salaries vary from person to person within the same profession.... just a thought to conclude.

===================================== http://www.qatarliving.com/node/58409

I surely agree with you. The critical impact of the imbalance, as I have noticed, is that the employees' turnover is high, because once some resources have found out they were hugely underpaid for the same job, the company loses their loyalty and maybe their place.

Salam

was the first person to use the term, 'third world'. He was Indian and he described his own people as such.

Sorry, if I offended any Indian people by using a term that was 'invented' by one of thier own.

Justmoi! Why?! Its only me thats racist,remember? ;)

I did actually apologise if it sounded racist.

I don't happen to think it was, but I understand the sensitivity of some. As the moderator did not remove it, I doubt many people would find it too offensive.

Just to 'justify' my not so politically correct use of third world. Below is a meaning and to be honest I think this does describe their own circumstances very well.

Characteristics

The underdevelopment of the third world is marked by a number of common traits; distorted and highly dependent economies devoted to producing primary products for the developed world and to provide markets for their finished goods; traditional, rural social structures; high population growth; and widespread poverty. Nevertheless, the third world is sharply differentiated, for it includes countries on various levels of economic development. And despite the poverty of the countryside and the urban shantytowns, the ruling elites of most third world countries are wealthy.

* sniggers *

Yes, it does sound racist actually...the 3rd world? There are developed countries that aren't classed as western!

misleading? It states that Brits earn double and then 3rd paragraph in, states that Americans earn the most.

Why was it not just a general theme of, 'on the whole Westerners earn more than people the 3rd world'. (Not very politically correct I admit).

People could be harsh and say you get what you pay for.

How many third world people are in the top jobs?

There may be a few but I doubt it. Why?

I don't know the answer to this and up to a point I think it is wrong. I am sure there are many that could do the job of a 'Westerner' but very few are given the chance.

However, I would say, that even if that person could do the job they would not be paid the same amount.

We cost more for some reason. Perhaps we expect higher living conditions. Is that racist or a fact?

I hope I do not sound racist with the above thread. My comments, I hope invites debate to the problem to hand.

Yeah right! Philippines is always worst as our Government sucks!

I wish we have Dictatorship or Parliamentary will be good. Democratic never been good since our past President Marcos step down....

In Indian words 'WHAT TO DO!' So we suffer from Low Pay even we work good!

@Wolfman - I totally agree with you. I am also a Filipino and I don't care how much my Western counterparts are making. I am happy enough that I am making more than what I could have been making back home. I accepted my salary because I felt that it was right for me and I believe that same goes with all other expats regardless of nationality. If not, then why accept a job after all.

@tallg - You are right. The survey should have included the percentage increase of what you should have been earning back home as compared to what you are earning now. As you have said, Brits, Americans and other Westerns earn around 1.6 of their salary back home. Personally, I am earning around 5 to 10 times of my salary back home. For others, they are just happy that they even have a job here which they don't have back home. If you compare 1.6 and 5, it will show that Asians are even luckier. If only all of us will look at the brighter side of light then all of us will be happy.

Also, will a Western come here for..let say 2,000USD??? Of course not because they can earn it back home. Why go through all of the hassles. But for us, 2,000USD will be more than acceptable.

In addition, they should have clustered their survey to various levels (comparing apples to apples and not apples to oranges)....The wide difference can also be attributed to this factor. Majority of Western Expatriates are employed on Senior Level Positions (white collared jobs) while a lot of my fellow Asians are employed on non senior (blue collared jobs). If you compare a western and an asian expat with the same level, then you will not see a major difference, at least not as much as the one being reported in the survey.

The Qatar government had a good plan to attract US professionals to work here and thereby bringing in experience, and young Qataris could learn. However, the problem is in execution of the plan. I wud say its quite right to pay an american 3-4 times more than paying an Indian if he indeed has worked in organizations known for excellence in their field or graduated from top US schools. Instead the HR people have recruited americans with little experience, came out of mediocre schools and worked in small organizations. I have seen many times local qataris that have graduated from good US institutions to be lot beter than americans that have been hired.

lusitano - unfortunately that goes on at newspapers day in, day out, with all sorts of data, especially surveys.

Exactly cynbob - it's necessary to offer attractive salary packages otherwise no-one would come. And that applies to all nationalities. Why would an Indian (for example) come here if he's not going to earn more than he could at home?

And you generally find Indians earn significantly more times their home salary than Westerners do, so it seems it takes a lot more to tempt them here than it does Westerners.

nicaq25,

Good, I did too. I am just not happy with the tricky handling of the survey data.

But do you understand the distortion of the results, deliberately done by the journalist.

The fact is that he compared apples with oranges, adding a provocative title, intentionally to provoke polemic, in other words, to attract readers, to sell.

This is dishonest and unprofessional.

But then again, we are where we are!

really, how much salary does one (irregardless of profession) need to make him 'happy'?

"I do live by the motto that pessimists are usually right, but all the great change in history was done by optimists" -Thomas Friedman

Tallg is right. I expressed this same fact on another thread and people argued about it.

If the relocation packages are not lucritive enough to compensate for the hardship of leaving the comforts of home, people (most Europeans and Americans) will not relocate.

The Middle East is definitely a place where the packages are much more lucritive because of the different lifestyle and extreme hot weather.

Of course, there are some people that just want to relocate for the experience of it all.

Just to "hang out" in a Middle Eastern country to experience the way of life and such is not why the majority of westerners come here.

tallg, no one should mind if they are coming to oil and gas companies and claiming high salaries. They are appointed and given the same grade in other sectors too where their skills have cheap substitutes..and that is what is the gest......

in fact, I joined the survey they conducted.

"I do live by the motto that pessimists are usually right, but all the great change in history was done by optimists" -Thomas Friedman

My comment was with regard to you saying that the high salaries were a gesture.

It's not a gesture. It's a necessity. If they didn't offer that much the Europeans and Americans wouldn't come.

I'd estimate most are earning 1.5 to 2 times what they could get back home. If they were only being offered the same as they could get back home then many wouldn't see it as worthwhile coming here.

There is a sense of appreciation for the Europeans and Americans among middle eastern people for their contribution to their oil wealth. The high salaries to them is a gesture of acknowledgement for the same.

I think Asians and others should agree with this as well.

But when you look at the things with human aspect, you are forced to put the facts in place..

Alexa, I think no. But we can atleast assume that someone is listening when we say something.

Exactly Alexa. So it doesn't matter how much I 'wish' things would change so everyone was paid fairly, because I can never actually 'demand' it.

As other brits have mentioned where are these jobs with all that money, ill send my CV lol!!

Though some posters need to be wary of qualifications, as more doesn't neccesarily put you in a better position. I know Dr's (Phd not medical) who dont use their Dr notation as they feel it shows you only have very narrow knowledge experiance and are not very versatile. Employers will also wonder why you have done extra study there has to appear to be some reason and teh qualification should compliment each other. Also what I have seen out here is that people have no concept of "working your way up' or 'getting their hands dirty' they think they can go into management when they dont understand what actually happens and is involved in their products/business.

nicaq25,

As a matter of fact I did complain and the Editor acknowledged the inaccuracy (but he did reserve the right to still compare apples with oranges and publish the article the way he did).

You cannot compare a British Senior Manager salary with an Indian Labor's salary or an Indian's Senior Manager salary with a British Labor's salary.

What I am trying to pin point here is that the journalist, misused the data gathered from the survey and that triggered racism!

Please do not take this remark as my agreement with any type of discrimination.

I totally condemn any type of discrimination, but unfortunately in countries (such as those of the Gulf) where legislation to protect employees and social justice is almost non existent, abuses do take place.

Don't get me wrong sag, I understand what you mean about 'wish' and 'demand'. It's easy for us all (me included) to sit here saying how everyone should be paid equally, blah, blah, blah. But it's another thing to actually get up and do something about it. i.e. to make a demand of someone.

Hence my question; has anyone on this thread got up and tried to do something about it?

Hmmm..tallg, it seems you don't want to give up on this topic..

When you think something unfair done, would you just wish justice was there or demand for it...

ok, now I abstain from giving anymore explanation.

with the above posted article you may voice out your own protest to their website. I'm sure they will welcome you as there are many who got the same opinion as we have here. This forum is for discussion only, and it is expected that others conformed and some don't.

As I said above, the criteria for the survey data analysis, is inaccurate.

Publishing inaccurate survey's analysis and making it worse with misleading titles, is unprofessional, irresponsible and malicious as it provokes polemic and ignites racism (as proven here by the way most QLers reacted).

What i want to know is how SAMAEL can afford a Harley on his meagre income..

"British expats earn double that of their Indian peers." Err, not really. This survey implies that Indian taxi drivers and British surgeons are "peers" and should earn equitable salaries. You will convince me that there is discrimination when you show that a British surgeon and an Indian surgeon who graduated from the same schools and have the same work experience are being paid differently.

Mandi

It was the "right tallg?" that gave me the impression it was a dig at me. Apologies if that wasn't the case.

As for whether it's a wish or a demand for change, I guess it's wish since I haven't done anything about it. A demand implies actually taking some sort of pro-active action. Has anyone here done that?

well i earn pretty low compared to most brits... but hey, i signed the contract and no one forced me to.

Now when renewal comes up, different story lol.

____________________________

well, tallg, I said 'some people' without any hint at you. I have already said I never go personal with anyone. I just use their post to convey what i have to say on the topic. Anyway, sorry if it so appeared. its fine that you do object such a system. I saw what you said as a wish than a demand for change.

sag - you implied that I didn't object to the way things are because I benefit from the situation. I took issue with this for two reasons;

1) because the assumption you made that I benefit from the system is false, as I've already explained.

2) because I do object to the system, as you can see from my previous comments

MIT STANDS FOR MASSACHUSETTS INSTITUE OF TECHNOLOGY. ONE OF THE BEST ENGINERING UNIVERSITIES IN THE US.IF YOU ARE LUCKY ENOUGH TO GET IN.

The survey is misleading and totally useless as they didn’t take into account the professional grade and job title of those who replied.

As an example, let’s say that the following people replied to the survey:

- 1 senior manager from the UK making 15000 US$/month;

- 5 clerks from India making 1500 US/month

- 3 shop attendants from the Philippines making 800 US/month

Based on the above data, is it correct to say that, in average:

- British make 15000 US$/month;

- Indians make 1500 US/month;

- Filipinos make 800 US/month

Of course NOT!!!!! This proves how stupid were the rules and conclusions of this survey!

tallg,

"Fair enough. Just be careful what you assume and what you accuse people of."

Just check how fair are you! I never accused anyone. I just blamed the system here. If you couldn't understand just read them again....

Your are trying to say that the system is like that and some people are the beneficiaries but my point is to question the system for those who want to bring the change...

Thank you...

jolena, i dont think i know everything...some of the facts that im stating are based on what i read here in ql forums only...

LoL...One and the only authentic comment on the post...

Life is never boring, but some people choose to be bored.... Boredom is a choice. - Wayne W.

your character?...You should read my post, it was an article..a result of the survey of a news agency. Don't get me wrong, the idea here is to let everyone know. Sharing information as we called it.

No bashing here, this is a reality and should be dealt with fair judgment by everyone concerned. See, Me, I belong to the lower part of the salary chain here, I don't complain, because it never gets me far anyway. If whining will result for an increase of salary, then might as well follow the trend, but no, I don't think whining will help me. Maybe just do the job right and avoid stepping other people's right.

"I do live by the motto that pessimists are usually right, but all the great change in history was done by optimists" -Thomas Friedman

deary me nomad - do you really think that all western expats get everything paid for them??? I guess everyone generalises about everyone else!

end of the day, i dont think anybody with sane mind has taken decisions based on their interaction at QL, because individual experiences differs..

Quite agree with the statement actually

One thing that I love about this forum... is that everyone thinks they know everything...

jolena...you must be saving a lot of money out of your accommodation allowance then...yes?

I'm American and I live in a not so glamorous neighborhood of Umm Guwailina with grafiti on all the walls and no view out the windows in a studio... I know a Pakistani from work who lives in a glamorous villa... We can all give examples...

while i agree that the cost of living in the country of origin has something to do with the differences in salaries, the accommodation part of the deal is something that puzzles me.

my american counterpart stays in a luxurious villa (company provided) with all the extra facilities you can think of, while i live in a flat with no extra facilities at all.

this friend of mine showed the picture of his house back in the US and it is nothing but a porta cabin...and im staying in a decent condominium back home (much much better than a porta cabin!)...

well im not complaining, just stating a fact...

what to do??? it is like this only!!

nicaq if you really believe that western expats avg. 16k or 19k per month then you are quite gullible.

“A lot of the people who keep a gun at home for safety are the same ones who refuse to wear a seat belt”

hello everyone.

I am US citizen thinking about a job offer in Qatar. I wanted to have an idea about the cost of living there. I am married and have 2 kids ( 4yrs and 1 yr old). I live in a 4 bedrooms house and own 2 cars. I make $80K a year. How much money I have to be making in Qatar to maintain the same life style and to make the job and the move more attractive to me and the family. thank you very much.

Good one, Henners!

There you go... and I'm sure Henners is not the only one with this experience. Some people really do talk outta their ar**, don't they?

*****************************************

Don't want no drama,

No, no drama, no, no, no, no drama

Are we looking at skilled professions here?

No we don't! I'm a brit and I'm on the same salary as any Indian or Philipino doing the same job. In fact, I'm cheaper at the end of the day because I'm here on my own and don't have kids to put through school. Plus I have far higher cost of living back home and can't afford to go home, which is why I stay here in this ridiculous country. So don't think for one minute that the colour of my skin makes me earn more than you. It really annoys me when people think that.

This post has a very good potential....of running into 6 plus pages.....

Among those pages all things that touch a human being will be call into perspective....

from race to relligion

from scum to scumbag

from friend to foe

from eating habits to bathroom habits

from the local climate to the local people

....and even the greatest recession.....

QL seems to be maturing....or is it not?

.....lol......let me have a good laugh from the sidelines...

Salary is paid against capability not in capacity. I am an expat from third world country that earns 5 digits USD a month.

I'm American and none of my fellow Americans earn $19,000 per month. It all boils down to relativity... $8k in the US doesn't go as far as $8k in India...

Thanks TallG

I lived 8years in Mexico and wanted to experience somewhere completely different....

Where I lived in Mexico was 99% Catholic and I didn't know anything about the Arab or Muslim world....

Location also played a factor as it is easier to explore Africa and Asia from here....

there was a job going so I took it... and stayed.. :)

oh and started the group Latinos in Qatar... so i have the best of all worlds :) :)

This is a no win discussion.

just to put things into persperctive.. I earn about 70% more than I did in the UK.. That includes the tax savings..

I discussed this with Indian and Pakistani colleagues.. They are earning between 4 and 6 times what they would in their home counries..

"Most Americans I know have ways around the real disclosure of their income and ask their companies to show a low base salary to avoid high tax. Not that it is a bad thing, but you guys do make out like bandits irrespective! I just feel bad for all the other nationalities that have to send their families back home so that they can support them with the meager salaries they get."-a comment from a reader in UAE

Agree with tallg, some come for the change in lifestyle or like me, for the experience of learning something new.Other come for many other reasons.

*****************************************

Don't want no drama,

No, no drama, no, no, no, no drama

I didn't come here for the money either and I'm prepared to leave tomorrow.

tallg, from your perspective, you'd be correct.

*****************************************

Don't want no drama,

No, no drama, no, no, no, no drama

I find it amusing that, while most people do come here for the money, others find it hard to comprehend that a few actually come here for the change in lifestyle and to get away from the sh!t in their own country.

People like MagicDragon and Oryx, tell me why you came to Qatar, if not for the money then what? Peace? Heat? The driving? Religion?

Don't get me wrong I love the culture and the people but if not for the money why live here over your homeland or some other place like Korea, Italy, Spain, etc....

i didn't come here for money only....it made the offer attractive but it didn't seal the deal by any means...

i had two similar financial offers..here and Bermuda.. i chose Qatar.

Alexa, sharp minded lady.

There is an exception to every rule.

"The expatriates that come here come here for one reason and one reason only". This is not true. I came here 16 years ago to raise my children in a peaceful environment.

I came here, to 'live' here.

Anil

If you travel around some other countries in africa you will find that gabon is relatively expensive... so it might be a nice surprise for you :)

Alex... agreed lots of fake certs around and many times i have heard against office bullying to get someone out and a chum in... AND that happens to Qataris!!!

Wow, I only read about half of the posts and then got bored. I really don't care if I make some people angry but the answer is so simple.

First off, I am American.

Second, I am NOT a racist, we are all created equal.

Third, have you ever seen a westerner as a personal driver for a local?

The EXPATS that come here come here for one reason and one reason only.... to make money. Yeah some get screwed in their contracts and don't make as much as they should, I've seen that with both Americans and Phillipinos. The foreigners that I work with all say that they make a lot more money over here then they do back home; and they make pennies compared to what I make. I make about three times more over here then back in the US and if it weren't for that there is no way I would be over here.

The reason why westerners make more money then others is because westerners started it all(discovered oil) and are the most advanced countries in the world (you can't deny it). It's not a race thing, I've never met a white person from India.

All it is, is cheap labor.

You didn't, force. I did.

MD,

Where did I say that this was racism.

This was just stupidity on part of the employers due to their inability to differentiate ppl based on their education.

Then, force1, you really witnessed a form of 'racism'. Congratulations on your 'discovery'.

Obviously it is possible to regulate it, as so many other countries in the world do.

And what do you really think you're going to do if your company loses your passport?!

They didn't.

At least the ones I knew.

If its such an issue why not bugger orf back home?!

Then why do they accept it??

MD,

I'm not saying that they have to work in Qatar.

But I know ppl (americans) who have applied for jobs and I know their offers.

I was shocked. They were good offers but again nothing special when compared to what ex-truck drivers and salesmen (british and australian, as I said in my post above) get paid.

And laws will probably never come in to prevent it cos there are many grey areas. Impossible

to regulate everything in black and white.

So, it goes back to "who's the boss" - sole decision maker or collective decision makers. All decide based on information obtained. Communication is key. If collective - less chance of decisions being biased by 1 or 2 persons' views and therefore, more fair.

You can't really tell the boss that he should pay you double your salary unless you justify it to him that you are worth it. And pls remember not to bite the hand that feeds you and take responsibility for your own actions.

If unhappy with situation - change it. Then I hear complaints about the 2 year ban - which is for non-competition purposes - not allowed in free market economy but does not apply here - fair because there is no uncertainty to its time frame - 2 years is a reasonable time frame. It then boils down to - why are you not prepared to work elsewhere for 2 years and colme back later? Why must you work here right now? And gripe about why your employer is not giving you a NOC.

If I were in the position where my employer does not give me a NOC, I'll leave. No problemo. Go elsewhere and maybe come back in 2 years or not at all. So what?

Btw, my employer also holds my passport. Did you hear me gripe about how illegal and unfair it is? No, I look at things positively. If they lose my passport for me, there'll be hell to pay - for them.

*****************************************

Don't want no drama,

No, no drama, no, no, no, no drama

At the moment.....

not totally true. in my husband company, there are south american or even indian earn more than the US/Canadian/British.

Everybody is right everybody is wrong, it depend where you stand

Really, force1, no MIT graduate has to work in Qatar!

Massachusetts Institute of Technology. Top ranking university.

I am not saying that the MIT (Massachusetts Institute of Technology) person took the job...he prob rejected it and stayed in the US prob earning $200k/yr even in this economic situation.

MIT is arguably the best technology uni. in the world.

You cannot call someone who gets in a idiot.

High school students have to "sell" themselves more to just get in than u prob had to to get a job here.

I'm sure these guys know how to sell themselves. Its just that over here there is a limited value on education and experience.

MD is right. No-one is forced to accept a job offer here.

MIT is Massachusetts Institute of Technology.

Yes, it's fair because that MIT idiot should also have learned how to 'sell' himself successfully.

One more problem I have noticed in Qatar:

A graduate from MIT will get paid the same amount as a graduate from some other random university.

This happens mainly in the Gulf. I have seen ads for managers/ senior engineers, requirements: Western Education, Anywhere!

Is it fair that some genius from MIT gets paid the same amount as someone from lets say some Community College?

Dora - it's internationally that different nationalities do different types of jobs (which is what this survey is saying), but it's not international that different nationalities are paid differently for the same work. I think that would be illegal in the UK and many other countries.

happy happy .... and both people accepted the job based on the offer they were given, so both must be happy with what they're being paid, correct?

As I said before, it would be lovely if they were paid the same, but it wont happen until laws come in to prevent it.

It has truth in it.

From experience and I am not questioning the survey results. Example: in my team, 2 new resources were recently hired, they both have the same job description, grade and title. They are from different parts of the world, one is underpaid, the other is higher.

There is slight difference in experience between them but not wide enough to justify the salary gap. They both contribute greatly to the project and passed the probation period successfully.

I was not the one who hired them by the way.

Salam

This isn't just in Qatar though is it? Its international!

Fair enough. Just be careful what you assume and what you accuse people of.

Well, tallg, the purpose my participation in the discussions is to convey the message to whoever it interests. No one is my target..Thanks for answering me.

I'd say that's almost certainly part of the reason Alexa.

tallg, why a Brit should be tempted when an asian fits the role? This may not happen in private firms but is common in Government sector...

Note : I am just addressing the title, survey is not the basis.

That's something you'd have to ask the individual companies.

By the way, I am not moaning here. By God's grace I earn good enough for my work. Although, there are those in inferior jobs who earn more than me. I am content because what i get is enough for me. I believe, if there is a discrimination it should be looked into..

sag - Supply & Demand is not my reasoning, it's the facts of how business works. Companies offer employees enough to tempt them here to work. The amount needed to tempt an Indian is less the a Brit.

And if you re-read my comment you'll see that I do object to it, by virtue of the fact that I said I wished people were paid according to the contribution they make to the company.

Finally, you've made an assumption that I benefit from all this. I don't work for a company based in Qatar, so it has no affect on me.

should also conduct survey on QLers...oh! they will learn so much out these issues.LOL!

"I do live by the motto that pessimists are usually right, but all the great change in history was done by optimists" -Thomas Friedman

.flan, i think you have fever (is it bec of the flu?),

you temp is too high, lol...

.

.

I see moaning as a positive indicator as long as it is coupled with constructive action to improve one’s life standards

Bashing and superiority /inferiority complex are what I find very irritating.

Salam

tallg,

"I was just explaining that that is how it is..."

why should some people object it when it actually favors them, right tallg?

I think its not the cost of living of original countries but the country of work should be the measure of salary.

I don't understand your demand and supply reasoning..

On the surface of it, there seems to be a major fault in the comparisons given. Surely you can only compare salaries when they are for the same type of work. Out of 50 British interviewed most were probably in mid to senior management right? Whereas 50 people from India or Philipiines would have less in management and more as labour, admin etc. So many of the comments made are not quite what it may seem.

but I would call it a "misconception". The "superiority" thing is still very much working against third world countries, sad but very true!

"dgoodrebel will always be the rebellious good one"

Precisely, Wolfman!

*****************************************

Don't want no drama,

No, no drama, no, no, no, no drama

Yes, as always QLers have taken this as an opportunity to moan again rather than read and comprehend the original post. It doesn't take much.

Fubar,

"The survey doesn't provide any evidence that when two people do the same job, their salary differs according to their passport...."

I think no survey is required to realise this in Qatar.

Do your own survey fiend. it won't take much time. just an interview with an asian expat dining besides you is enough...

"However, it is well know that it is sometimes (often?) the case here in Qatar that different nationalities doing the same job are paid differently."

Agreed. That may be true, but:

1 - the survey does not provide any evidence to support this statement

2 - by extension, people are reading into it that a Brit does the same job as an Indian, the Brit is paid double.

For instance, when it comes to MANY jobs here in the GCC, people are paid within salary grades. Employees of a certain level will receive a salary within the salary band, but the difference will not be double.

All I want to say is that most people commenting on this thread have either not read the survey, or have totally failed to grasp the basis if the results. (And, unsurprisingly, they are the sames ones saying that they ought to be earning more....)

Regarding why different nationalities earn different amounts for the same job... well that's been done to death on QL. My only comment is that while they may have the same job title, they tend to have different outputs.

anal_fag, what's the diameter of your pi hole?

tallg and MD, how, with all your rational minds, would you say that the pay cheque should be determined based on what you could potentially earn back home? It should be based on what you contribute to the company. If your skills are so important to the companies then the pay cheques you recieve are worth. But when you match equally with those less fortunate expats in skills then you(not to b taken personally) simply don't deserve that pay.

Pay should be equal to all based on skills. It should be upto individuals to decide whether to accept the offer or not based on their potential for earning back home.

Just tell me, is there any law that Qatar(or any country) should have expatraiates form all countries and they should be encouraged to work here?

In a previous huge project here in Doha, I've dealt with some of those highly expensive resources who only Succeeded in failing the project.

They're just retired from the army and have rarely been outside their country, and never to the ME. They were ultimately replaced. The project kicked off again, with mitigated damage.

Salam

fubar said - The survey doesn't provide any evidence that when two people do the same job, their salary differs according to their passport.

You're right, the survey doesn't show that. I think QLers have misunderstood what the survey is showing. It's more a reflection of the jobs different nationalities do.

However, it is well know that it is sometimes (often?) the case here in Qatar that different nationalities doing the same job are paid differently.

sag - I'm didn't say that the pay cheque should be determined on what you could potentially earn back home. I was just explaining that that is how it is.

I would love it if everyone was paid based on their contribution to the company. But that's never going to happen while countries have different costs of living and the laws of supply and demand hold true.

Clearly the people surveyed weren't all doing the same jobs.

The reason the differences in salaries look so vast is just to do with the number of people from different countries and the sorts of jobs they do here.

There are tens of thousands of Indians here working as laborers, so that is obviously going to drag down the average salary of Indians.

Similarly there are lots of Filipinos here working in the service industry. Again, that is going to drag down the average across the sample.

The Americans that are here are skewed towards the oil and gas sector, where it's not uncommon to find offshore contractors who could easily be earning more than US$2000 PER DAY. So that's going to pull up the average salary of US nationals.

The survey doesn't provide any evidence that when two people do the same job, their salary differs according to their passport.

I worke in an oil service company and there were guys from England australia and even Canada who were technical and needed to calaculate area of a circle and never even knew the fromula and when I showed them they would ask me how to convert radius to diameter and what was the value of pi.... I just found that incredible and the y claimed to be engineers.

well if you're going to compare taxi driver salaries to white collar jobs then of course you'll get a gap.

OMG! it has been discussed 1000 times! as tallg said, westerners would never come here for $2000 a month.

From me i would add. IN GENERAL, people from arab and asian countries are desperately looking for the job, and willing to grab the frist available one. Westerners are OFFERED the positions and take them only when they are sure it will be much benificial for them than what they have back home.

Also, westerners mostly work with the big and strong western and local companies, which are rich and therefore are willing to pay requested amount. Asians are mostly working with the small businesses which are hardly surviving by themselves...

So noone to blame. don't want to be underpaid, do not accept the job! simple.

*********************

“You become responsible forever for what you have tamed”. Antoine de Saint-Exupéry

Like they say a crying baby always gets milk

It's ok to moan a bit, if it's going to professionaly updrade you. After dissatisfaction you will reject, leave the firm and get hired in another one (in the same country or another) with triple the previous salary, now that you've realized your value and the market demand.

Salam

Well...all I can say is that I know Australians and Britishers here who were truck drivers and salesmen back home earning prob around $10k per month here in Oil/Gas Companies...

I am far away from Qatar. No regrets enjoyed my couple of years there. Now I am in Gabon lovely tropical climate. LAid back style.Extremely easygoing a2.5@ h" lunch break. Beautiful bars, climate, women.....not necessarily in that order. Will contribute to QL when I feel my mind needs a little mental gymnastics.

aren't you? Oh I see some potential moaning happening.......

We're not discussing faults here, we're reasoning and exploring the rationale behind salaries gaps at the international level.

Your point is right though.

Salam

you are right... cause i had this employer who offered me a job but wanted me find out more about his company and get back to him..

i was shocked at his behaviour, did not even bother to get back with him.

but now i have this employer texting me and mailing me back to negotiate...

Well, no point moaning about who gets what......it was the individual that signed the contract so whose fault is it?

anil ... apologies accepted.

My statement was uncalled for. That was like hitting below the belt

reality. It's all in individuals power to negotiate and agree on terms. If you agree, nobody to blame for any discrepancy between salary grades, you decide based on the cards laid and not what you perceived! You win some, you lose some!

"dgoodrebel will always be the rebellious good one"

I am still perplexed as to why some firms would hire a $14,500 resource, where they can hire a $7,000 resource with almost the same skill set required for a particular job?

I have seen this happening in more than one project I've worked on, in a few Arab countries.

anil ... i dont have to be married to a brit to tell you the price of a bottle of water in the UK and Lulu Centre. Anyone with common sense can do that :)

for we vs them. I could not care less like Wolfman said. when I was in Qatar I was on par with expats if not better as I refused to join on a remuneration based on my country of origin. I joined on a salary based on the international benchmark for the job. But when I saw some of the junior staff form Asia and compare the salary to the expats I was horrified. I stood up and fought for it. But the company did not relent. So on principle I quit as cannot bwork for a company which bases the compensation package on nationality.

you are probably right thalib01.....

wolfman - you've hit the nail on the head. Thank you.

anil - it's not a case of "us against them".

According to The Times of India, salary increases will be higher there this year than in US!

NEW DELHI: Here's some news that beats the gloom. Despite the economic slowdown, a majority of Indian companies are still hiring employees, reveals

a survey conducted by HR consultancy firm Hewitt. That's not all.

The survey says the average salary hike in India in 2009 will be 8.2% - the highest in the Asia Pacific region.

Though the projected salary hike is understandably lower than the increase of 13.3% seen in 2008, it's higher than the estimates for China, which is pegged at 8%. By comparison, salaries are expected to rise by 3.2% in the US and 2.3% in Japan, the report says.

Hewitt said the survey was conducted on 480 Indian companies over December 2008 and January 2009.

http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/Business/India-Business/Average-salary-hike-to-be-82-this-year-says-Hewitt/articleshow/4156703.cms

Not bad for some, then! :D

holding double post graduation degrees... i am being forced to take up a job as medical representative... if i was brit or american with the same qualification, i would have been made the director of that company

You are married to a Brit so you will definitely bat for them

its a surprise that have been in qatar since decades... but my higher education was abroad... have been heating up my head for 3 months now... no suitable jobs... no career.. have to go back to my previous employment.. even though comparing to a salesman here , the pay is less. but life is a 20 times better outside...

im a filipino. i dont earn that much compared with my UK or US citizen counterparts. does that bother me? no. negotiations happen at the start of employment and employers would always want to pay just enough to get maximum performances.

thats why it's called a job. J-ust O-ver B-roke

if you agreed to the terms of your contract, that means your satisfied with what is offered to you. my counterparts however, the brits and the american dudes, demanded a bigger wage for watever reason they have. i wouldn't care less. the point is i'm satisfied with what im getting and i said i'll take the job. no use fuzzing about how big the difference between me and my UK couterparts' salary is. it will only make me hate my ignorance in the beginning. I didn't do my assignment from the beginning and research on the international benchmark for salaries on my job level so the blame is on me. its my call. its my responsibility, its my doing.

stop blaming the difference in races or colors or whatever as an excuse for our low paying job.

just my humble opinion.

"For the strength of the Pack is the Wolf, and the strength of the Wolf is the Pack."

kabayan! usap tayo DITO!

I hear you!

The surveys UK average is 3 times what I earn here!!!

So, by that 'average', an Indian earns 50% more than me.

You can do a lot with figures.

"Deaths in the Bible. God - 2,270,365

not including the victims of Noah's flood, Sodom and Gomorrah, or the

many plagues, famines, fiery serpents, etc because no specific numbers

were given. Satan - 10."

what you going to do next then thalib01?

2009 Salary Survey results revealed -

"Unlike last year's poll, which took place during a boom time for most companies and staff in the region, this year's questions - answered by more than 3,000 respondents during January - were posed at a time when firms were cutting back on their workforces and budgets... and it shows.

Analysis of our data shows it doesn't matter how much you earn or how senior your role is, there are no longer any guarantees about job security in the region"

i was having a well respected and well paying job in a UK company. and the day i came here. there seem to be no value for the degrees you hold .. nor do you get a job in accordance to the degree or respect... just see laborers around... make me sick

"cost of living back home" - is the main reason but inadequate justification for these people who gripe about being unfairly treated when they are actually not.

If one is capable in work, will definitely get ahead if they are positive and proactive - just a matter of time. Not capable, may be temporarily lucky but will not stay ahead - just a matter of time.

*****************************************

Don't want no drama,

No, no drama, no, no, no, no drama

For those with assets, property, family etc back home, one has to convert currency and send money home. No one would move countries and be worse off for it and unable to pay their bills back home.

"Deaths in the Bible. God - 2,270,365

not including the victims of Noah's flood, Sodom and Gomorrah, or the

many plagues, famines, fiery serpents, etc because no specific numbers

were given. Satan - 10."

When I first came to Qatar I used to convert to Indian currency till I frealised it was a pointless excersise. My point is if I planned to live in Qatar these are my expenses. for the next 11 months and I spend according to that. This would be the same expenses for all people based there irrespective of nationality. The one month or whatevr time the are back home is their problem and all the financial liabilities they have in their home country is their problem how they take care of it.

Anyway I am no more in Qatar due to the same policies implemented by my company. I asked them to pay me on my competence and merits and not on my skin tone. So I just packed up and left. I believe in Gods eyes every man is equal and if we do not stand up and resist then we are one of the scum.

UK employees earn how much on average???? $14,500 is over £10,000 a month. Maybe someone can advise me where I can find a job like this for my hub or, at least, which companies are paying this sum and whether hub would have to sleep with the Managing Director! lol

its all to do with the skin color...... lets wait till whites are minority and uneducated [most of them are already].. movies show americans having done nothing beyond high school.. specially prom night is more important than college.. wonder why?

what one wants against what is being offered? And do the survey said an apple to apple survey? I doubt it very much!

"dgoodrebel will always be the rebellious good one"

Petrol - 5QR a litre plus over 5000QR a year just to keep a car on the road.

Cigs - 30QR a packet

1 bedroom cheap apartment - 500,000QR+

Utilities and local taxes - min 1500QR per month

Then there is the tax rates and national insurance which comes to about at least 30% of your salary given to the government

"Deaths in the Bible. God - 2,270,365

not including the victims of Noah's flood, Sodom and Gomorrah, or the

many plagues, famines, fiery serpents, etc because no specific numbers

were given. Satan - 10."

Lol MD ... too true ...

He is lying, tallg. Rents in Qatar are three times higher than in Germany.

anil_fig said "Expenses in all countries are the same."

How on earth did you figure that out???

Of course UK and US ex-pats earn more than Indians and Filipinos, they'd never come here to work otherwise. It's called supply and demand. Like it or not, companies pay what ever it takes to tempt people here to work - and it takes more to tempt UK & US than it does Indian and Filipino.

What the survey should have done is compared salaries as a percentage of what you could potentially earn back home.

UK & US earn perhaps 1.5 or 1.6 times what they could earn back home. I think the multiplication factor for Indians and Filipinos is greater than that, isn't it?

anil a bottle of water in the UK cost you about 5 riyal at presents exchange rate, while in Lulu Centre cost you 1 riyal.

So cost of living in all countries is not the same.

Im a brit and i could only wish for $14,500 a month lol

Expenses in all countries are the same.It is all relative. What astounds me is that some of these expats are not as as ualified as the Asians or not as smart and hence a salary difference boils down to racisim.

This is such a messed up place.

"dgoodrebel will always be the rebellious good one"

Brit expats wont come out if they got paid the same salary with people from other counries like Philippines or Indian.

Interesting. Race decides paycheck?

It's all to do with cost of living back home ....