Muslims becoming Christian

u will know after death islam is a religion on peace ....so plzz every one peace

if u also want to unlock ur iphone call 5125244

Here comes all idealism about religion...Wish that i could share my point of view...But ive been taught that this is one of the most argued topics (i.e Religion,Politics,and so on)Better stick on the middle..

treating her sister

Oryx its always better to learn the facts from Afghanis, those who are living in the hell (they desire that hell) I had chance to meet several of them some who came to Umrah. Talibans are no longer care taker, did you ever hear of suicide bombings when Taliban was ruling? Untill the invasion everything was going smooth

Taliban banned kite flying because the power lines were an open hazard in the city

And the kites which were being used by the young kids electricuted them

Now before u go judging me i was just responding to one of the accusations against the taliban thats all

 Sorry, can't be bothered to read all the responses, but my big question is, what kind of spaghetti was this guy eating that his parents figured out he'd converted to Christianity?

Visit www.qatarhappening.com

she is far from hateful..... she is speaking against a hateful regime as am I.

her writing has well thought out arguments that i find interesting.

 she does not seem hateful at all to me.

the only hateful people in this thread are the ones who support the taliban. 

___________________________________________

"Even a stopped clock gives the right time twice a day." Withnail & I

Why does she hate members who disagree with her? Why the personal attacks when you disagree with someone?

I think she suffers from some personality disorder!

This is a very bad example/image of QLers. 

If u read Budhhism then you will see it is a philosophy and a code of life too.

As for defending the Taliban I don't know where to start...

banning TV

banning kite flying

no health care for women

no education for women

executions at half time of football matches

Why did so many flee the country if they were ok?

When i do good I feel good, When i do bad I feel bad and this is my religion.

Pure Love...

wiki the most unrealiable

 The taliban did halt the drug trade but NOW they live off it and control the buying and transport of it out of Afghanistan. So they changed their tune!

"Deaths in the Bible. God - 2,270,365

not including the victims of Noah's flood, Sodom and Gomorrah, or the

many plagues, famines, fiery serpents, etc because no specific numbers

were given. Satan - 10."

First it is the nail polish, then comes the micro-minis, after that comes the deep cuts.

I guess you want it just like the USA where anyone can dress the way it pleases. If someone wants to see undressed people they can go to the strips and see beauty at its best.

Anyways I personally consider women working in strips to be involved in sex trade.

The Talibans eradicated the poppy trade. They publicly executed people for having sex with young boys. As for beating women, its ture that they did beat women but I have always been against this inhumane pratice. Talibans were far from ideal rulers but at the time they were the best rulers.

Lets take out the Talibans from the scenario, even now the Government has banned the Indian TV serials from being aired in afghanistan. even music is banned by the Government. So who is to be blamed now?

" Opium poppies have traditionally been grown in Afghanistan, and, with the war shattering other sectors of the economy, it became the number one export of the country.

The Taliban have provided an Islamic sanction for farmers ... to

grow even more opium, even though the Koran forbids Muslims from

producing or imbibing intoxicants. Abdul Rashid, the head of the

Taliban's anti-drugs control force in Kandahar, spelled out the nature

of his unique job. He is authorized to impose a strict ban on the

growing of hashish,

"because it is consumed by Afghans and Muslims." But, Rashid told me

without a hint of sarcasm, "Opium is permissible because it is consumed

by kafirs in the West and not by Muslims or Afghans."[101]

But in 2000 the Taliban banned opium production, a first in Afghan

history. In 2000, Afghanistan's opium production still accounted for

75% of the world's supply. On July 27, 2000, the Taliban again issued a decree banning opium poppy cultivation. According to opioids.com, by February 2001, production had been reduced from 12,600 acres (51 km²) to only 17 acres.[102] When the Taliban entered north Waziristan in 2003 they immediately banned poppy cultivation and punished those who sold it.[citation needed]

Another source claims opium production was cut back by the Taliban

not to prevent its use but to shore up its price, and thus increase the

income of poppy farmers and revenue of Afghan tax collectors.[103]

The official verdict of the Taliban however was otherwise. Mullah

Amir Mohammed Haqqani, the Taliban's top drug official in Nangarhar,

said the ban would remain regardless of whether the Taliban received

aid or international recognition. "It is our decree that there will be

no poppy cultivation. It is banned forever in this country," he said.

"Whether we get assistance or not, poppy growing will never be allowed

again in our country."[104]

However, with the 2001 US/Northern Alliance expulsion of the

Taliban, opium cultivation has increased in the southern provinces

liberated from the Taliban control,[105] and by 2005 production was 87% of the world's opium supply,[106] rising to 90% in 2006.[107]" 

(from wiki)

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this is fact, we cannot slander without knowing the truth Where as I can provide you enough proof of Karzai's haram life. I have even proofs of Drunkard Mrs. Mushref

we cannot compare  him to OBL, PM omg thats slandering  and again its big sin to call Taliban drug promoters

 Now by your logic - as there is a drug trade in Qatar (notice quite a few recent arrests) then this is the resposibility of the rulers( the Al Thanis, run the country.) QED the Al Thanis control and promote the drug trade in Qatar!!

Silly boy

"Deaths in the Bible. God - 2,270,365

not including the victims of Noah's flood, Sodom and Gomorrah, or the

many plagues, famines, fiery serpents, etc because no specific numbers

were given. Satan - 10."

If in doubt, blame the Yanks !!!

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so whatever drug trade is going on, whatever the sex slavery is going on, the blame lies with the Americans and their puppet Karzai.

Interestingly Karzai was running his Hotel Business in States when all of a sudden the US Government decided to bring him to Afghanistan and make him the president there. This shows who is running the show.

Anyways as soon as the American are out of Afghanistan the suicide bombings will also be a part of history.

 Just like Iraq where the suicide bombings has started after the capture of Iraq by the American tyrants

dreamland you are living in.....

 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Taliban

 Erradicating drugs, sex slave trade etc.........I think not !!!

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 Now the taliban run the drug trade. It's expedient now they are out of power and need the money to fight Nato.

"Deaths in the Bible. God - 2,270,365

not including the victims of Noah's flood, Sodom and Gomorrah, or the

many plagues, famines, fiery serpents, etc because no specific numbers

were given. Satan - 10."

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has animals of all species and kinds. But this is where the laws come in.

Talking about Taliban, I dont agree with the way they ruled Afghanistan. They have some good deeds to their credit as well like bringing peace, eradicating drug trafficking, abolisihing the pratice of child sex slaves, etc etc

and lets see how many become immorals.

Take out the traffic law and lets see how many accidents happen daily.

It is human nature, the only thing that keeps us within our limits is the punishment and the laws. For those who cross their limits law punishes them.

If the laws are taken out from the civil society then the only thing that will prevail is might is right. The situation will be just like the Wild Wild West. Hope you get my point Mr. Paul.

I dont wish to judge the strength of your beliefs but not everyone is so full of morality at heart like you, if you claim what you are.

Anyways I have never considered myself as a perfect gentleman, I still I have plenty of space for improvement.

whats acceptable and whats not in life.

I know Murder is wrong, i dont need any books to tell me that. Its common bloody sense !!

 A sense of morality keeps me on the straight and narrow, that and respect for other people......

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.. and while every fish is swimming continuously around in his own fish bowl, knowing only this as his reality, he is unaware of the vast ocean out there..

There's more to this all than meets the eye! 

You dont need any books to tell you how to live. Heck you dont need any laws to tell you, your limits and boundaries.

Lets live like animals who dont know how to read and write and who dont give a rat's A about laws or regulations.

Welcome to the Jungle.

If there are no laws in this world there would only be chaos and anarchy.

Islam gave the laws 1400 years ago.

 Applause. I'll buy you a drink next time you're in Doha.

"Deaths in the Bible. God - 2,270,365

not including the victims of Noah's flood, Sodom and Gomorrah, or the

many plagues, famines, fiery serpents, etc because no specific numbers

were given. Satan - 10."

I think its unfortunate that you all need a book to tell ya how to live, sleep, eat, dress, f*** and everything....If yer cant live yer life how you want, then you are just a robot with all the millions of others......

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so called muslims who convert.

I have been to churchs, have been to buddhist temples and  now I believe that Islam is not only a religion, it is also a code of life.

It gives you the insight, the education, knowledge on how to live your life.

Before u go treating Wafa as a hero

u shud know that wafa is a Psychiatrist not a historian

If you did something illegal, would you trust a dentist to represent you in front of a court of law? or a lawyer ?

would you trust a psychiatrist to teach you history or an actual historian? Im, sorry but thats what wafa sultan is - a psychiatrist

If she was a true human rights activist she would know that Terrorism has no religion and is actually a product of political or social unrest accompanied by any ideology. Just like the KKK are "Christians" and Nation of Islam are "Muslims". We have to remember that these extremists are always a minority and once you start treating them like the majority - you are aiding their efforts to cause further unrest.

U r better than this!

just yesterday u were thinking about Buddhism - LOL!

By the way u know that Christianity isnt much different than Islam if u hold true to the original word

Hold true Insha Allah u will prosper!

not white though they might give sympathy tears. I dislike carnations for their dull attitude

Can never go wrong with a lily. Carnations fit in just about any arrangement.

I am very sincere in seeking pleasure. I am so happy for those who are baptised to chrisitanity. I admire Wafa Sultan and Magdi

the recent hero. 

Wish some of my relatives convert into christianity, cos I find it difficult living with them bcos I have to obey my Lord keeping kinship, punishment is so severe if we brk kinship.

Some of them do not have internet connection else I would have sent them youtube links. My suggestion to all human beings either submit totally or just

convert to any suitable religion

"O you who believe! Enter in Islam completely." (2:208)

We should welcome apostasy with open arms

infact I must create floral arrangement with  theme  freedom from clutches of Islam.

Thinking what material i should use in the arrangement

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 How to be an English Patient? Just listen to Mr. Paul daily advise on Alcohol and woman. LOL

"I want to be from London, England."   Even Londoners dont want to live there....  Its a dump !

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PH gets on PM's nerves all the time

If theres anyone who can blow away PM's cool its PH

PM chill ! - and PH chill even more

U both dont have to go at each others throat all the time!

That's why people like "Princess" said her mission is to educate Muslims.

Allah/God help us!

That explains a lot!    

You really are a nutcase!  Does your doctor husband have any experience in Schizophrenia??

I want to be from London, England. I was considering West London, maybe not. Hey about East London? Better yet, about South London? I don't think so!  I'm reconsidering what my compass is pointing at, at least it points to the magnetic North, and not North of London, Is it from the flow of  different dialects coming from the british population causing this  electromagnetic commotion?     

Lol Abdallah man... never mind :P ur comments r funny. 

IF EVERYONE WAS TO TAKE AN EYE FOR AN EYE, THE WHOLE WORLD WOULD'VE BEEN BLIND TODAY - MAHATMA GHANDI

As one wise gentlemen said above,, let everybody become what ever he wishes and remember god dosent need the humans ,they need him.

If some one is converting to any religion its his choice to do so, and i must say am glad and happy for him for his courage he took the initiaitve to accept change in his life as choice not as default.

Hats off to those who converted from Christians to muslims, hindus to muslims, buddists to muslims and vice-versa.

I wish i had such courage to change things in my life.

good luck

Ridiculous to keep bringing up an issue that happened ages ago!

if you, DG, or anyone else I may have offended wish to clarify matters with me, humble themselves and myself, and be open to self criticism then you are all welcome.

The fact that people have this warped view of piety is another challange facing the muslim ummah.  No matter how a person strives for piety muslims will never be satisfied that these standards have been met!

I really feel no need to continue with such childish behavior as character assassinations!

If you have some valid advice to give me then it is most welcome pm!

Maryum : Umm Hasan bint Abdullah Alshabrawishi

PM said This is the "Princess" we know so well ...

"Most muslims know very little about their religion QT. "

But you and your so-called "scholars" do, al hamdulillah.

We both know that Allah did not prescribe the "Shariah" directly in the Quran. It is extrapolated from the tafisr and Hadith -- again problematic when you are talking about things as serious as passing judgment on what is in the heart and taking a life for it

Sound like you know "my" scholars so well. In fact, you sound like an egyptian person I know who only follows "her" scholars. This is something that is not islamic.

I follow the person who presents the proof behind what they say! I research until by trying to prove him/her wrong until I am unable to do so.

Again, as you may know, it is haram to pass judgement on a persons heart. Islam is a judicial system for the world in which we judge only based on a persons actions. I.E. if a person outwardly rejects Islam yet aknowledges what this religion is about then he is an apostate. Allahu Alim what is in his heart and even the person with some belief will enter Jannah eventually.

I think it is a case of more assumptions of what I am upon rather than knowledge on your part PM. And if you don't know it is best to ask questions!

Asalaamu Alaikum rahmantullah wa barakatahu

Maryum : Umm Hasan bint Abdullah Alshabrawishi

Ifu wud have read my earlier post about whats written in the corinthians

you wud have come full circle.

Hi Mr. Paul I dont need to see God to know if he really exist or not.

Just like the air we breath... you never see the air but u feel it right? 

For me being able to sleep well at night & to wake up with a healty body everyday is a good signed that God really exist & he LOVES me...

OUR GOD WILL ALWAYS BE ALIVE IN MY HEART & IN MY SOUL...

Peace!!!

"Even if  LOVE is full of thorns, embrace it. For in between those thorns there is a ROSE that's worth all the PAIN."

"Do not think that I [Jesus] have come to abolish the Law (the Old Testament) or the Prophets; I have not come to abolish them but to fulfill them.  I tell you the truth, until heaven and earth disappear, not the smallest letter, not the least stroke or a pen, will by any means disappear from the Law (the Old Testament) until everything is accomplished.  (Matthew 5:17-18)" 

"Then Jesus said to the crowds and to his disciples: 'The teachers of the law and the Pharisees sit in Moses' seat.  So you must obey them and do everything they tell you. But do not do what they do, for they do not practice what they preach.'  (Matthew 23:1-3)"

Most people do not know the proper teachings of their religions and mUslims arent an exception to the rule.

Otherwise who in their right mind would put up posts about Islam giving the death penalty for apostasy (which is not entirely correct) when his or her own religion orders the same

Dont u think so too?

But who says he exists ?

It will NEVER be proved either way, so everybody, just get on with your own lives and allow others to get on with theirs.....

 And lets put an end to this b******* once and for all !

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what i mean to say is... no matter how religious u are... or whatever religion u are in but if your living or attitude is not good  what’s the used of ur religion??? I know people  telling that they love GOD, almost spending their life inside their church & even teaching others for the words of God but when they got outside the church their not doing what their religions telling them!

They are the one whose..

= abusing their families

= abusing their employees

= No respect with their housemaids.

= Driving without thinking of other people

= Killing people

= Adultry= stealing = telling bad words to the other people

Loving God doest mean going to church everyday & reading Bible or Quran & other Holy Books is enough. You must know how to understand, act  & used it as ur daily guidance. Do u think God is happy & satisfied seeing you always inside his church & listening to his words but not using it on ur everyday life??? Think of it….

Im not Atheists im a Catholic & im not telling that only Catholics (& no other religions) will go to heaven because i know that there are some Catholics who are not good same with other religion.

Im not also telling all of u guys that i will be saved & will go to heaven when i died because i also performed some mistakes in my life. Whats important now is im trying my best to be a good Christian as much as i can. For sure God will see my efforts to changed.

Ur religion cant not saved u but its on how u live & act on his words. Is God forcing u to obey & love him??? NO! Of course NOT! Its all up to u if u will love & follow his words. Thats how God Love us... Giving us the right to choose!  So what road / path u want go (good or bad)? Where are u now?  God bless us all!!!

"Even if  LOVE is full of thorns, embrace it. For in between those thorns there is a ROSE that's worth all the PAIN."

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I know PH is American.

Being American (or English for that matter) does not mean you automatically use the English language correctly!  

"For me to be considered good if not holy is not depends on what kind of

religion you are in but on how you spend  ur life here on earth!"

 Who is gonna consider you holy or good ? 

And if Atheists dont believe in any Mighty form, who can judge  us ?  There is no one to judge us, certainly not these Scholars or priests or any religious leaders from any religion.....

 We can argue this for eternity, without any one been right or wrong.

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Only if everyone was like u, there wudnt be any misery on this planet

We all know that we have hundreds of religions the world.

And all of them telling us that they are the right path or they will guide us to see the true meaning of religion & will teach us the true words of GOD. 

Its not also true that if ur in a particular religion u will be saved & will go straight to the  heaven once u died.

For me to be considered good if not holy is not depends on what kind of religion you are in but on how you spend  ur life here on earth!

thats all...

"Even if  LOVE is full of thorns, embrace it. For in between those thorns there is a ROSE that's worth all the PAIN."

While imbibing the value system of the core beliefs of the major religions, atheism rejects the risk reward fundamentals of those same religions.

The risk for doing good increases and the reward (though fictional in religions) decreases, thereby dragging the whole society into the doldrums of insane human conduct.

Religion is what keeps the poor from murdering the rich.

Napoleon Bonaparte

I would rather live my life as if there is a God and die to find out there isn't, than live my life as if there isn't and die to find out there is.

Albert Camus

Any belief is based on a theory or a fact

All the religions give u a reason for existence (The why and How) - though it might be a unproved theory

Atheism doesnt give any reason but it has a theory on only the how!

But may i remind u it is only a theory

no they just don't believe and probably live quite happily without belief...it isn't necessary to exist without a belief!

Belief in disbelief?

its not a religion really, they don't believe in anything to be a religion.....

never ever try to come closer to Islam/ Christianity.

Only it is more ambiguous then any religion known to man

try atheism, its no hassle.....

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Olympic torch, last time it was in Malaysia. Time to preach buddhism

Dont know why all these days I am feeling buddhist such a peacful religion  with that harsh bible verses " Show him no pity. Do not spare him or shield him. You must certainly put him to death

propaganda site......"look at us, we saved the world" and all that stuff.

Not that im bothered, been a non believer and all that , and proud of it as well....

And to all of you who say "theres a special place in hell reserved for people like you" ...I say  , good, saves me having to wait in line.

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beware of the God squad....

I'll bring the popcorn, Adey, you get the Ale..

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Deuteronomy 13:6-9 "If your very own brother, or your son or daughter, or the wife you love, or your closest friend secretly entices you, saying: Let us go and worship other gods (gods that neither you nor your fathers have known, gods of the peoples around you, whether near or far, from one end of the land to the other, or gods of other religions), do not yield to him or listen to him. Show him no pity. Do not spare him or shield him. You must certainly put him to death. Your hand must be the first in putting him to death, and then the hands of all the people."

2 Chronicles 15:13 "All who would not seek the LORD, the God of Israel, were to be put to death, whether small or great, man or woman."

Why would anyone who use Windows Vista returns back to Windows Xp :))))

Guys...why don't you check www.jesusneverexisted.com and find what a great religion Christiantiy is :)))))))))))))

"What makes you different can make all the difference in the World"

they are half hindus half christians.

Princess you drained all my efforts, now pls dont post apostasy hadith I have already done that.  Christianity has much to offer

and its one of the best religion, ppl are converting to christianity. Muslims should now read bible who knows they will be guided.

I'd like to repeat "The punishment for apostasy in Islam is not death if it is as a change of ones belief system only"

But you guys forget the point that the same punishment is quite clear in christianity and judaism also.

Deuteronomy 13:6-9 "If your very own brother, or your son or daughter, or the wife you love, or your closest friend secretly entices you, saying: Let us go and worship other gods (gods that neither you nor your fathers have known, gods of the peoples around you, whether near or far, from one end of the land to the other, or gods of other religions), do not yield to him or listen to him. Show him no pity. Do not spare him or shield him. You must certainly put him to death. Your hand must be the first in putting him to death, and then the hands of all the people."

2 Chronicles 15:13 "All who would not seek the LORD, the God of Israel, were to be put to death, whether small or great, man or woman."

" Particularly the fact that he may deem me an unfit mother at the very

least and fight for custody of my children. (as custody only belongs to

a muslim mother.. not non-muslim)"

 So custody of children is only allowed for Muslim Mums, non muslim mums can have their children taken away ??????

 And to QT, PH is an American , so she she be able to understand the English language pretty well.

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Most muslims know very little about their religion QT.

While it is true for many things..

We have a religion which also serves as a judicial system in this world and has decreed punishments.

Most muslims agree this is also the case. And the only difference is argued about the conditions of the crime and the extent of the punishment.

One example is of a thief who steals. The punishment is for his hand to be chopped off.

However, it has many conditions. I.E. the thief does not steal for a need and hunger being one of them. Or that it is done by an ignorant person who was not taught the law. etcr.

Without the hadeeth we would not know these conditions. Which is why it is so important that people do not just follow the Quran but also its companion to help interpret and clarify our Holy Book.

Maryum : Umm Hasan bint Abdullah Alshabrawishi

Anyone is welcome to prove it!

Because it is only a case of misunderstanding and knowledge of me and my circumstances if this is the case!

Something which I doubt people on a forum or even in real life could gain a complete view of unless I spelled it out to them!

And only goes to show how judgemental people are rather than clarifying with me their feelings!

And I think it is rather sexist to call women cows too!

Maryum : Umm Hasan bint Abdullah Alshabrawishi

Everyone knows you condradict yourself, time and time again!

Soon, I will trawl through the posts to prove it!  but I have meetings soon( less than 6 hrs), so goodnight!  I hope you find your path and light! 

CRAZY MOO!!!

Its not my mission to teach others..

It is part of my islamic duty to correct others who say something which is not backed up with islamic knowledge.

Do I contradict myself?  The fact that you cannot quote me doing so tells me you really don't have any proof.. If any of your quote above are any indication.

Above you said that that on one of my first posts to you on here that I personally claimed to supporting death to apostates.

It only showed that you clearly took what I said out of context!

And even worse that you turned a personal issue I once experienced and criticized me without any warrant to be so cruel!

Maryum : Umm Hasan bint Abdullah Alshabrawishi

You just don't make sense.  Your posts just contradict each other!

The worst thing is, I actually think you don't know any better!

But it worries me that you think it's your mission to teach others!

(Please don't ask me to quote what you said on this as well, cos everyone knows what you said, and please, don't embarress yourself)

open my eyes to what?

Maryum : Umm Hasan bint Abdullah Alshabrawishi

Hmmmm.   Sorry!  your answer just doesn't cut it!  As I expected!

I guess it'll be some time before we debate again!

I hope you find what you are looking for in life!

It helps if you open your eyes and take your head out of the sand!

What are you talking about Qt??

Yes I was referring to the death of this life. Allahu Alim what Allah will decide on the judgement day.

If a person apostates from Islam the judicial law is that they (after it being established have sound knowledge) will be put to death!

Never said this was an opinion I held.. but of course I'm always happy to let people know my opinions if they ask.

Maryum : Umm Hasan bint Abdullah Alshabrawishi

QT ... I think it is quite obvious that I wouldn't think this considering that I, myself, almost apostated and lost alot as a result

And if you read the whole post within its context then it is quite clear that I was not referring to my own personal opinion as well.

Maryum : Umm Hasan bint Abdullah Alshabrawishi

Really????   Why did you say the above then.  What is death???

I was under the impression death was of this life!! not the next!

Please explain yourself!

 "...I almost left Islam (which the sin for it is death as you may know)"

That is exactly what you said!  If you don't think that people will think that you condone individuals being killed by this statement then you really need to learn the English language properly!

 I don't see any reference that I personally think that a person "should" be killed for leaving islam (without sound knowledge).

I said that his was a fact that a muslim who leaves for christianity may be put to death. And I said this to point out the extent of hardship that was upon me by openly telling my husband the feelings and doubts I was having.

Particularly the fact that he may deem me an unfit mother at the very least and fight for custody of my children. (as custody only belongs to a muslim mother.. not non-muslim)

Thank fully he was knowledgable enough to realize that I needed his support at this time rather than persecution. And understood that I had not apostated but just become rather confused about the religion.

Maryum : Umm Hasan bint Abdullah Alshabrawishi

PH, Pls respond to what I said!

And even more important the system needs to be run by someone who has knowledge of these conditions.

What I see is that although the knowledge is out there, many seem not to use the mercy which was sent by Allah. And are very quick to make judgements without mercy and justice.

Maryum : Umm Hasan bint Abdullah Alshabrawishi

"My husband and I are multi cultural and even at a time I almost left Islam (which the sin for it is death as you may know)"

Please tell me, this is not what you meant, and I'll apologise to you!

Most muslims think that it is up to God/Allah to distribute punishment!  But you demonstrated that you think otherwise!

Could you link me to that post QT.

It is in Islam that a person who become a christian (after having sound faith) apostates from islam and is deserving of death according to the scholars.

And I have been consistant with this in my posts above.

p.s. you make it sound like I staunchly condemned a person leaving Islam! Which I am sure is not reflective of the post which you interpretated as such.

Maryum : Umm Hasan bint Abdullah Alshabrawishi

I remember your first ever post that you sent to me.  You said that a person should be killed if they move from Islam to christianity!

That is why I have never had any respect for you!  So, tell me! are you changing your stance?

Salax Allah has blessed us with a fitrah to know right from wrong

May he increase our eeman and protect us . And make it easy for us to hold onto the sunnah which will burn our hands like hot coals. InshAllah alahumma ameen

Maryum : Umm Hasan bint Abdullah Alshabrawishi

Yes I agree..

It has been one of my main moans to the scholars who have the ill fate of being on the recieving end of my complaints towards them.

They leave alot to be desired in terms of explaining the fatwas they issue.

Remember that a piece of knowledge in every generation is left from the ummah until the judgement day. So much so that in the very last days the people will only whisper about a book that was said to be sent by Allah. And will no longer possess it.

Likewise, one will walk into a masjid and not one person will have khushoo in his prayer.

Maryum : Umm Hasan bint Abdullah Alshabrawishi

According to the scholars

Beliefs in the heart are in the outward actions of an individual. Hence, a person who does not pray five times a day is termed a disbeliever. And his wife is ordered to divorce him as a result.

Every apostacy case must be evaluated individually in order for a scholar to establish whether punishment of death applies or not.

And yes I don't like it either nor do I think all scholars/people of knowledge have the capability to judge such matters.  But I cannot prove it is not in Islam. 

Maryum : Umm Hasan bint Abdullah Alshabrawishi

No it doesn't

Neither does someone saying that hadeeth, that have been authenticated as well as implied ayahs in the Quran and the interpretations by scholars more learned then us, make them less then valid when applying islamic principals in fiqh matters towards the fact that according to islam apostates are put to death.

To be honest, you and I both know that what I have stated holds alot more weight in scholarly circles.

 Maryum : Umm Hasan bint Abdullah Alshabrawishi

I am also not a fan of Dr. Zakir Naik. I feel he has gone to far insinuating that he is a scholar through his talks and yet has no scholarly background under his belt.

I have heard that.. Anyone who learns Islam to argue will not have gained knowledge. And in my eyes that is exactly what mr. Naik is doing by battling between islam and other religions.

I also often find him making quite a few mistakes whilst doing so with regards to both other religions and his religion.

Its is 100% true that a person who apostates after having sound belief and knowledge and then leaves Islam is put to death.

This is based on the fact that Islam has come perfect for all times! And that the person understands that Islam (tawheed and Mohammad is a prophet of Allah WITHOUT DOUBT) is the truth but rejects it anyway.  And only after a scholar explains it to him in a way that he understands.

This is not for the person who uttered the shahada without observing its conditions and understanding what it fully meant.  

Many muslims often make the assumption that anyone who utters the shahadah is put to death if they become an apostate and this is wrong. In fact, a person can observe all the islamic acts however it depends on his belief in his heart.

And I wonder on the judgement day how many of the so-called muslims will be declared non muslim by Allah?? Because of their misguided beliefs they somehow credit to Islam.

Maryum : Umm Hasan bint Abdullah Alshabrawishi

show me some group of people

remember always you will find happiness only in "islam"

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hi everyone you wana know what is rigth, check what Dr. Zakir says

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I slap my forehead with a loud slap of disbelief, incredulity, sadness and hysterical laughter!!!

btw satan is round my house , so no need to worry your cotten socks about him circling around you.

JFC please grow up. 

"Deaths in the Bible. God - 2,270,365

not including the victims of Noah's flood, Sodom and Gomorrah, or the

many plagues, famines, fiery serpents, etc because no specific numbers

were given. Satan - 10."

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Hey mr. abdullah does it mean that all the people in the world whose not a muslim are all assistant of satan???

How dare you to say that?!

U know u should think about it first before u said those words...

u should also know that not all QL members are muslim & as much as possible pls try to respect us as much as were respecting ur religion...

Thats all...

"Even if  LOVE is full of thorns, embrace it. For in between those thorns there is a ROSE that's worth all the PAIN."

Like a group of philosophers who don't really know what they are talking. I would just try to be a good human being and let Allah decide whether to send me to hell or heaven... simple... don't eat each other's brain out. just be what you want to be.

ok eco..so this is what you were reffering to...

 was QL topic and one passionate muslim said : She may be wrong, but thats for her and her god to judge, not us 

Alexa I have met few of those pious ones some are my relatives some are acquaintances.I cant get closer to them no matter I try hard every day

me and my corrupt attitude

Eco....Islam is for only pious people??? Who are we to judge who is pious and who isnt? I always thought it was up to god to judge...Isnt it about whats in peoples hearts and not necessarily what people show others. I know a lot of people who are "pious" and their actions leave a lot to be desired...

IT IS TRUE THAT THE HEART CAN SEE....WHAT IS ESSENTIAL IS VISIBLE TO THE NAKED EYE.

It is better to endure the hardship of education than to taste the bitterness of ignorance.

This is a

very sensitive topic indeed......But just to add a few points of my

understanding.

In Islam

virtue does not connote forsaking the bounties of nature that are lawful. On

the contrary one is encouraged to lead a healthy, active life with the qualities

of kindness, chastity, honesty, mercy, courage patience and politeness.In

short, Islam has a perfect and complete code for the guidance of individuals

and communities alike.

As the entire message of Islam is derived from the Holy

Quran and indeed the Sunnah and Hadith (the traditions and practices of the

Holy Prophet, peace and blessings on him) it is immutable in the face of change

in time and place. It may appear rigid to the casual eye, in actual fact it is

most certainly an adaptable way of life regardless of human changes.

Allah Knows Best!!!!!

What is the relevance of it being the fastest growing?  That is constantly thrown out in conversation, and I never understand why. 

"Do not judge so that you will not be judged . "For in the way you judge, you will be judged; and by your standard of measure, it will be measured to you.- Ring a bell?

But it still remains the fastest growing religion in the world

May be genetically the human race is evil and evil people love the religion of islam - LOL!

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better to have quality then quantity like rabbits. Islam exclusive for pious ppl ONLY

or u just feeling like pissing people off today

Well, this is a very sensitive topic to discus in public...

But in general, we should respect each others religion as its equally important to every one. Above all, its ones personal freedom and choice on where he puts his/her faith. No one can force religion on any one until and unless he does not accept it by heart.

There are lots who simply pretend to be what they are not and also become part of those groups who decide what and how one needs to follow the religion they belong to...

Islam, no doubt is one of the most simplest and easy to understand and follow religion and people who don't understand its true value are simple making it more and more complicated.

As I understand almost all globally accepted religions teach you the same rules that will help you understand the true meaning of life and to lead a noble life.

I hope I am right with my point, if not please excuse me...

I think converting has more to do with the community that you're living in than the actual religion itself.

life is beautifull....enjoy!!!!

What a way to launch a topic for discussion....Hats off to you

I am glad ppl are running away from Islam.

Alhumdullilah, perfect  I  usually get annoyed when ppl come to Islam's fold and then we have this tagline Islam is fastest growing religion.

So would it be a different attitude towards

a) Muslim becoming a Christian

b) Muslim becoming a Buddhist

???

I like the way scholars are reviewing hadiths and reconsidering the standpoint.  that is great....

Religion is no big deal. If both religions are so perfect then why do people get converted in the first place???

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freedom.......:) let everybody become what ever he wishes, remember Allah doesnt need the humans, they need him.

No 3 - bit harsh old chap!

I thought Islam was the religion of peace.

  maybe a heretical interpretation of Apostasy at their own convenience.....  I want to be English, do they speak Spanglish?

life is beautifull....enjoy!!!!

Religon is a guideline....fo live a good & positive life...

It depends on a person how he interprets the guidelines...to his benifit...

Grow up and read the Quran again

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There is a saying that says ,you can debate on any subject in this world except religion, it is never ending. 

Everyone is free to believe in whatever religion he or she believes in, as for me I believe in Allah.

InsyaAllah!!!

life is beautifull....enjoy!!!!

It is important that we try to become good human beings than to focus on religious issues...religion is never bad..its the individual who is ....

So be a good human being like I AM .....

Sorry I did not read it fully. Started yawning towards the end. The topic is interesting. The details are not (to me at least).

People converting - both ways - are a minority if not negligible percentage. Cannot build the relation between two major religions on the decision of few people. I do not find it a cultural issue.

Now, everybody has some brain cells and the information is easily available and accessible. So it is their decision.

Of course. Abdulla comments are refused and condemned. hope everybody will neglect them

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The punishment in Islam has been generalized by the not so learned

The punishment pertained to a deserter during the times of war wereas today it has been generalized to define any kind of honest conversion on the basis of a particular belief system

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 Smoke, Mr Paul and britexpat Good and interesting debatable points of view. Will see and wait what  kind of SNAFU, this thread will turn out to be.....  I want to be drunk in Ireland then piss my guts out in England!

Of the world around him.......The same "we are right, every other religion is wrong" senario.

And Britexpat, you are right. People will use this as an excuse to inflame more hatred

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we should learn and respect eachothers.thats the only way for peace.

:-)

*When hands reach out in friendship, hearts are touched with joy*

http://www.myswitzerland.com/en.cfm/home

Mr Paul.. There is no real divide..... It's something people exploit for their own needs..

Islam and Christianity even further.....   Shame !

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Faith conversion has been going on for years and will continue to do so. The sad fact is that most people forget about the main issues and focus on the aspect of "taking a life" if someone converts. I know one person who converted to Christianity in England and he's still alive. I also know four people who became Muslims. The more we learn about each others' religions, the more easier it becomes to interact. It is surprising how much the three major religions have in common.

Oryx Get ready for the opinionated  and not so opinionated views.....  I want to be A Yorker!

you mean everyone which dosent believe in islam(Quran)is following shaitan?

nope thats not true.sorry.

*When hands reach out in friendship, hearts are touched with joy*

http://www.myswitzerland.com/en.cfm/home

a wise handsome looking kitty once said " It doesnt matter what religion u follow in life, know that when u die, we are all going back to the same God." of course the sinners are all going to the same hell too :p 

_[]~SMoKE~[]_

If anyone leave islam, he/she is really a unlucky person

The reason of their leaving islam is that:

1- their family are not strong to teach them islamic education.

2-they are become addicted of bad things and want to get them for

ever, which islam not supported. so, they want to lave islam to

get that.

3-they are becoming the assistant of saitan(devil)

and so on.,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,

You go Girl !

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