Pope Benedict XVI to 'resign' post

VATICAN SAYS BENEDICT XVI WILL CONTINUE TO BE CALLED "HIS HOLINESS" AFTER HE STEPS DOWN ON THURSDAY AND WILL BE KNOWN AS "POPE EMERITUS"

This thread is declared dead.....Amen

Great post wirehead, thanks for posting!

stumbled upon this article from the washington post today:

http://www.washingtonpost.com/lifestyle/style/pope-benedict-xvis-leaked-documents-show-fractured-vatican-full-of-rivalries/2013/02/16/23ce0280-76c2-11e2-8f84-3e4b513b1a13_story.html

so it was the vatileaks scandal and the italian mafia in the vatican who made him give up? it says that the pope did try to make reforms but in the end he was the one who had to go. does this mean an italian pope is in the works?

pope benedict even mentioned it on his ash wednesday homily, and that was probably the most direct he can get:

“We can reveal the face of the church and how this face is, at times, disfigured,” Benedict said in his final homily on Ash Wednesday. “I am thinking in particular of the sins against the unity of the church, of the divisions in the body of the church.” He called for his ministry to overcome “individualism” and “rivalry,” saying they were only for those “who have distanced themselves from the faith.”

the main culprit does look like a villain:

http://blogs.telegraph.co.uk/news/ruthdudleyedwards/100202421/its-time-cardinal-bertone-and-his-wrecking-crew-were-run-out-of-town-2/

i wish they make a movie of this someday

I saw this one in one Revolutionist blog.

The Vatican - Promoting peace by one of the largest shareholders in the Beretta Arms Company.

hmm...interesting. but i want to see more complicated conspiracy theories. there's not much written after the announcement of his resignation. those in the article are stuff that are pretty much easy to guess.

i wonder how the vatican's puppet masters actually run things in the holy see. and how the election campaign for the next pope is doing. if i don't hear exciting stories in the next few weeks i might be forced to read angels and demons to satisfy my appetite even if dan brown is a bad writer.

http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2013/02/15/conspiracy-theories-why-did-the-pope-really-quit.html

I like this comment very much. It may be a strong message that the pope want to sent to the selfish world around, by his example!!

That was good. Reminds me of Ghandi, no more passive resistance.

tarantino-esque! ^_^

http://youtu.be/QP3wrQncuSI

now this is a nice, fun way to make fun of religion. not boring like posting 'jokes' about the same things over and over again.

He must have got a more lucrative job offer! Even the Pope deserves a rise once in a while.

Fight for power is everywhere.Great people do everything possible to remain seated in power. Very few voluntarily come out with resignation.

The pope admitted that he is weak and resigning due to that reason.

I just found out who's gonna be the next Pope!

It's Pope Betty the First! Amen!

I wonder what fake signifies for?

I know, but points for originality. Anyone can get caught with a hooker while embezzling church funds.

Ha ha fubar, one of the church's finest. Still not a patch on some of the corrupt American preachers down the years

just agree with you? Are you that good?

Padre, with same people like NM to meet in Doha, I am better here. Some people just know how to belittle people and see themselves too good!

Well, what do you expect with holy people?

flor, just continue posting THAT and all will be perfect! :)

Flor are you back in the Sand Pit or posting from Phils?

pfffffftttttttt, 2!

pppffffftttt !

flor1212 padre nice to see you back!

Are you referring to this chap, QDC?

http://www.theregister.co.uk/2007/10/11/autopsy_controversy/

you must be joking. It only means you don't know what the topic is!

OMG...he's back. Geez. Now we just need Tahsinmim back and QL will again be complete :P

Very true Fathima, probably only the unborn child is without sin. That is why we do not need leaders in relgious matters trying to tell others what to do. Look at the American Evangelical Preachers, they commit more sins than I can shake a stick at!

I'll just ignore Flor, he is on the payroll of the POEA and cheats his fellow Filipinos so I have no time for him.

no where to go! Even in war, there are rules to follow! Courtesy is earned but you'll never get it!

Brit, atheist don't believe in God, but how many times this QDCL use the word or a word that signifies the presence of God. This guy is a fake!

Surely is there anyone alive on the face of the earth today who can claim to be without sins and vices? Do those vying for the position of the Pope actually have to claim to be infallible and free of mistakes?

Yes, off track. Back to the Pope.

To paraphase the Bible, the next person who should be Pope should be he without sin, then he can cast the first stone and tell others what to do with their lives.

Going to find it difficult to find someone in the Church without sin though...

There's an awful lot of "keyboard warriors" on this site MN, do they count?

Fubar, even Benedict said that it was better to use them than to spread disease. Which is why I think an African Pope can take that message even farther.

Nomerci just pointing out the rules. After all its a Religious institution we are talking about!

This has nothing to do with this thread, more to do with the inconsistency of the Moderators!

Its a bit like wishing Christmas the birthday of Christ is not seen as a Religious Thread but celebrating Prophet Mohammad Birthday is seen as religious!

Please carry on the with Thread, The comment was for the Moderators anyway! Looks like they chose to ignore it anyway!

The difficult thing about the condoms in Africa problem is that they say they listen to the church by not wearing condoms, but are ignoring the church on the issue of promiscuity.

The church will argue that it's stance is reasonable - if you are monogamous and only sleeping with your marital partner, barring any outside influences like injecting drug use or medical misadventure, the chances of contracting HIV are close to nil.

As in most religions, people will follow the convenient bits and tell themselves the other bits aren't so important.

but how will the catholic church grow if they allow the use of condoms? The muslims will then outbreed them.....

don't forget every sperm is sacred.

Perhaps we could change the topic of discussion to who will be the next pope?

The two most likely to take over, are a Canadian Cardinal; Marc Ouellet or an Italian Cardinal again Angelo Scola. One has charisma, but the other is more 'connected', powerful and puts a lot of energies into his job.

It is great that the other potentials include an African, American,Argentine and a Brazilian.

I would really like to see Cardinal Peter Turkson of Ghana replace him.

Put aside gays and women for the moment, the major issue the Catholic Church has to address is the use of condoms in Africa and other developing nations, not as contraception but as a means of protection from sexually transmitted diseases. There are an awful lot of Catholics in Africa and many of them still listen to the Vatican.

Wanted. Sexist homophobe to keep Christians following blindly without question. Must be good with kids.

Apply

The Vatican

not true. papal infallibility applies only to proclamations of official church doctrine, not of his deeds or opinions. and sometimes opinions relating to doctrine do get rejected, even if it comes from a pope. quoting from wiki:

"In July 2005 Pope Benedict XVI stated during an impromptu address to priests in Aosta that: "The Pope is not an oracle; he is infallible in very rare situations, as we know". His predecessor Pope John XXIII once remarked: "I am only infallible if I speak infallibly but I shall never do that, so I am not infallible". A doctrine proposed by a pope as his own opinion, not solemnly proclaimed as a doctrine of the Church, may be rejected as false, even if it is on a matter of faith and morals, and even more any view he expresses on other matters. A well-known example of a personal opinion on a matter of faith and morals that was taught by a pope but rejected by the Church is the view that Pope John XXII expressed on when the dead can reach the beatific vision."

and i don't believe in that. my soul can burn in hell

Ha ha fubar I was saving that one...... You got there' first.

Ahem, but how can you say "the pope is only human, not god. he does make mistakes."

The Pope cannot be wrong, because he's Pope. That's what Papal Infalliability refers to.

If you believe that the Pope can make mistakes, you go against thousands of years of Catholic teaching and doctrine. Either you believe that if he made mistakes he isn't Pope, or he didn't make mistakes. There's no middle ground.

The people in th Catholic Church are responsible, they held positions of power, positions such as preist, bishop and pope. People the faithful thought were men of god and could be trusted but they used their positions of trust to abuse children, thousands of them in many different countries for many, many years. Not only that but the institution of the church activity covered it up and aided them in their abuse.

To me these people are the scum of humanity.

first and foremost, a church is a community. a church is not one without its faithful. at least that's what was taught to me since i was six years old.

what you are referring to is the church hierarchy, with all its complicated layers and levels of responsibility.

your opinion on its definition obviously varies, so let's leave it at that

and yeah, this discussion is definitely more interesting than the doomsday prophecies that have been appearing on my facebook wall since the pope announced his resignation.

UK, we are NOT talking about religion here, but about an institution.

This is a peaceful discussion, it is interesting and I do not quite understand why you feel the need to throw a spanner into it.

wirehead, IMHO, there is a difference between THE CHURCH, and the community. The Church is a representative of the faith, the community are the 'faithful", they do not , as a first instance,represent the faith, but the faithful, the community.

Therefore, IMHO, THE CHURCH has in the first instance responsibility towards the reputation of the faith.

Th faithful, the community, has responsibility towards the group, their actions and deeds.

THE CHURCH is the umbrella, an authority the faithful can turn to.Also an authority that needs to keep the faithful on the right track in the faith.

Now, if THE CHURCH, like in this case and so very many others, messes up, THEY are fully responsible for the reputation of the faith. THEY are the leaders in the first instance. If the faithful mess up, then in the first instance they are responsible themselves, then, if the problems do not get solved, THE CHURCH, as the umbrella needs to step in. which is pretty useless if they are making themselves a laughing stock....

Oh my ..it's a joke!..the king died and the jester frowns...you insinuated sensational facts about others you know not off and simply you said its a "Joke" how do I believe others you said..

Moderators why is this not in the Religious Forum? Please do the needful :)

imho, there is a difference. the church is a community of believers in the faith. the people who run it are a mere, albeit privileged, part of it. they are supposed represent and be 'shepherds' of the faithful, but that does not mean that whatever they say or do are the same as the rest of the church.

Wirehead, who are the people who run the church if not the church?

IMHO, they ARE the Church, they represent the faith.

well you do come across as someone with a holier than thou attitude. which some people here (okay, me) may find irritating.

nope, the sex abuse scandals are not small mistakes. and they have done far worse things in the world. not the church nor the faith itself, but the people who run and are part of it

The last two you quoted are jokes so don't worry about it so much.

The Catholic Church has done much wrong in its history but I wouldn't not consider widespread, systematic child abuse to be a little mistake. Not only did this happen they tried to cover it up including the current pope.

I'm not attacking the Catholic Church specifically as I have some agenda against them but institutions that claim to be holier than thou and try to interfere in all aspects of daily life should come under the most scrutiny.

not a staunch catholic, but is not believing in same sex marriage a serious crime? why impose your standards on others? for someone who's not supposed to care, he sure meddles too much.

but really, why all this hate on the catholic church like it's the only human institution that does wrong? yes, it is terribly corrupt and they did commit serious crimes against humanity, but they have done a lot of good too. and christians have been persecuted in the early days, and some still happen these days. but no one seems to care about that here.

the pope is only human, not god. he does make mistakes. people shouldn't expect too much.

"ACtually the Pope must have done something that even the Catholic Church could not tolerate. Probably had sex with an adult woman."

"He just wants to spend more time with other people's grandchildren."

can anyone prove these as facts from someone who's so obsessed with facts?

http://www.popscreen.com/v/5ZgMA/Steve-Hughes-Whats-wrong-with-being-offended

Everyone has an entitlement to their opinion. As long as you don't start verbally abusing those who disagree with you.

Some people are so sensitive, I'm called anti Muslim, anti Indian, anti Filipino, anti Scottish and anti anything if I say something against their beloved people or ideas!

Apparently just having an opinion is a crime in the eyes of these opponents of free speech. However most are babies and only express their outrage on QL.

Of course they have a right to be offended but they have no right to never be offended but something in this world.

Why would you assume that ?

In other posts, QDCLover has clearly stated that he leans towards atheism. Which ofcourse is his right..

is not practice in CAtholics! With your words, I would presume you are a Muslim?

Don't forget he also insulted Muslims when he quoted a Byzantium King saying that Mohd spread Islam by the sword. While it may be factually true as head of the Catholics it was a very imflamtory thing to say.

They ask for evidence. When he was a cardinal he was in charge of investigating these cases and decided to do nothing as it would be damaging to the church. They is also a letter signed by him as a cardinal moving a paedophile preist to another area after committing chld abuse over many years and acknowledging the evidence against him.

The cover up in the Catholic Church globally is well documented from Ireland to the US to the Philippinees and pretty much every where they operate their company.

No I don't pay taxes to the Catholic Church but when they start committing serious crimes I will,not stay silent.

For sme reason when QDC is critical of the Catholic Pope, people say he shouldn't comment because he's not Catholic.

There are others on this thread who aren't Catholic who have said far more unsavory things about the Pope and little boys...

To all the staunch Catholics out there....what QDC is saying is true. It has been proven, it has been publicized.

It is NOT gossip, those are proven crimes that have been committed by catholic priests and the Vatican has tried, and somewhat succeeded, to cover them up.

Now, the crimes the Vatican has committed...don't even get me started..:(

This has been my favorite response so far :)

"The Pope is stepping down. He will be remembered as a visionary who helped protect the church from gays, women, and poor people." @RepJackKimble

his opinion, his action. so why bother>

where are your facts ?....only gossips you have...

for an atheist you are terribly narrow-minded. you do not have a right to demand, not even impose your opinions, to any changes in the church's stand on some issues like some government as you are not a member of it, do not pay taxes to it and you don't even believe in it.

of course these crimes should never be defended but it's not as if he started it all when he became pope. it's been happening for centuries and yes, he did not do enough to solve the problem. but he did not pretend that it did not exist either. he has apologized for them. yes, more needs to be done. but does anyone honestly think he can solve it in just a few years when it is a big flaw in the institution itself? that is not reason enough to judge him as a bad person imo.

the most fascinating thing about the catholic church is that it is a living, breathing human institution. it has imperfections and is made up of imperfect beings like the rest of humanity. it reflects the best and the worst of human nature, all the while attempting to go against the laws of human nature as well. just looking at how colorful and mysterious the politics within the vatican are makes it so interesting. they do recognize and apologize for the mistakes they have committed, even if it takes hundreds of years for them to do so in some cases. like acknowledging that the earth is indeed round, apologizing for the inquisition, even acknowledging evolution in its own ways. not all religions do that.

What are you talking about it is not hearsay! When he was a cardinal he signed the letter to move a paedophile priest from one parish to another. That is fact. He was a member of the hitler youth, fact. His stand on contraception, against all,medical advice fact.

Hearsay is not logical until proven...you are doomed with your reasons...you have irrational thinking.

To add. This is before we start to talk about the Catholic Church's stand on contraception, Women priests, homosexuality and equal rights for all. Truly an evil corporation. (But one of the richest company's in the world)

The Vatican in particular has many sins to answer for and should be held accountable for their crimes against humanity. Here is a man who was made pope who was a member of the hitler youth and covered up child abuse in the church, even going so far as to move a paedophile to another parish because of the crimes he committed. If that is something you want to defend shame on you.

QDC try to insult all religions what you are doing on Roman Catholic... your not even a single part of it..If you have balls to do it...it makes your tails swagging and your balls rolling...Is this a tread made to muck and insult the catholic church?...it is stated clearly and nothing else.

he doesn't have a religion and does not believe in god. so he thinks he's above everyone else.

for someone who needs 'proof' before believing in something and throws out scientific terms every chance he gets to make him seem credible and intelligent, he sure assumes too much without 'proof'. even if such affairs are absolutely none of his business. if religion is irrelevant because he now has answers about the origins of the universe, why bother posting stuff that he doesn't care, much less understand enough about just to mock the things he doesn't believe in?

going back to the topic...whatever the real reasons are, i sure wouldn't want to still be working at 85 years old. his job's not even the normal 8-hour workday, but a full time job in the most literal sense of the word

You are part of religious teaching..I think your religion not teaching you...

Goj...do you really think that he himself took that decision....lol

Well he took a very wise decision. Hopefully other long serving kings and queens, tyrants and despots around the world will follow his wise example

pretty unprecedented, but a wise decision. it is admirable that he is able to admit that he cannot fulfill his role properly anymore. much better than be a sitting senile pope where other people end up deciding things for him while waiting for him to die.

he's not as popular nor as charismatic as john paul 2 but he is a pretty intellectual person.

so what do we call him after that, pope dowager? does he retain his papal name benedict xvi or does he go back to being joseph ratzinger?

would be exciting to see how the politics would play out though. the process of selecting a pope is probably the only time the catholic church becomes democratic. or is it? we never know because it all happens in closed doors. will the jesuits come into power this time? will they finally get someone from the third world? or will they go italian again?

nomerci. c'est la vie!

ACtually the Pope must have done something that even the Catholic Church could not tolerate. Probably had sex with an adult woman.

drsam, nothing hinders those people from anything...

but that will hinder greatly the papal conclave.

now way for under the table deals and arrangements.

In further explanation the Pope has announced his decision to resign is completely innocent. He just wants to spend more time with other people's grandchildren.

QDC, I can't let you say such awful things about Latin.

From when the Pope started Tweeting:

Roberto Spataro, secretary of the Pontifical Academy for Latin Studies, which Benedict XVI founded last year, agreed, telling the Vatican's semi-official newspaper: "Twitter is a tool which requires rapid communication," he said. "In English you say 'the corruption of the best one is horrible'; in Latin, three words suffice: 'corrupt optima pessima'. It is a language which helps to think with precision and sobriety. And it has produced an exceptional heritage of science, knowledge and faith."

Now I think they should have a Pope Idol contest, where all the wannabe Popes compete against each other.

Crieria

Ability to wear silly hats

Speak Latin so no one understands you

Have a liking for young boys

Be over the age of 70

Be a little bit fat

Be a secret satanist.

now the kids are safe from leaving pope what about the new one is there any guarentee for the kids safety

is one QLer who has already resigned ..

exactly cheru :)

It's one thing to be a child molester. It's a far worse thing to be the man at the head of the organisation protecting them.

Good riddance to this awful man, in my opinion.

being an atheist does not mean you have no opinion on things that are tangible such as religion which affects human society.

Theists talk about abstract concepts that cannot be proved, what we are talking about here is a man who has huge influence in the world and therefore should be challenged.

They have opinions...others have smeary character.

You mean they are atheists while bashing one religion? They are not atheists when their religion is under scrutiny?

remembered as the one who "allowed foreign workers " - he allowed didn't force but the Pope used force to show his skills LP ( that too small kids )

What are the Atheists doing in this thread? BG, where is LP. I am waiting for his comment.

A person who compares sh*t with a clean food & thinks that both are equal surely will have that conclusions...it is much better to treat people like dogs in their own country than others who fly to countries and treat those people as dog (and call it as their strategic foreign policy)

Today's politicians cant be compared with popes and priests..

cherukkan they r part time atheist

Yes Nom.. ur right.

I'd say the politics in the Vatican are worse than those in the most corrupt country.

The real truth why he resigned will NEVER be public.

Will he get a NOC? but he can still search for new jobs around the world:)

Yes.. In History and in our heart Pope Benedict XVI name will be their always.. Now chance for a Pope from Kerala, India..wait and see...

britey what happened to the rest 264

Whatever we say here, history will remember him only as Benedict XVI, the 265th Pope.

the kids n their parents will always remember him for his good deeds

he just said he will resign for his post not from his extra "curricular activities"

So what will the Pope be remembered for? Being a nice old man or assisting child abuse by Priests. For me the latter, to allow such a thing to continue and to cover it up is as bad as the abuser themsevles if not worse.

http://www.spiegel.de/international/germany/munich-abuse-case-archbishop-ratzinger-failed-to-deal-with-suspected-pedophile-priest-a-731683.html

All other had their opinions too..

It is not about kingdom...it shows how much you know about kingdom and Papacy things..

And u know everything...

for sure there is a huge reason behind his resignation.

well see later..

Thelonius now ur very straight...we know u in other threads..

No investigations. no need for conspiracy theories. The pontiff has said that he feels he is too old to carry on. Th Rottweiller has succumbed to old age.

Hats off to him. Not many politicians or religious leaders are able to take this step.

Amen the end of child molestation

God Bless our beloved Pope. He was really a Blessing to our church. Thanking God for Benedict XVI.

Strictly personal. He is a human being.

Obviously there's going to be a host of investigations and analysis as to why he made such a drastic and controversial decision, and the gossip mongers will be hard at work now spinning the rumor mills. Wait and watch!

Here's from the Guardian:

These are the main reasons the pope gives for his resignation in his statement this morning:

• His "advanced age" (he is 85) means he is no longer able to carry out all his tasks adequately.

• Both strength in mind and body are necessary for the job of pope, he says, and in the last few months such strength has deteriorated in him.

He also announced in the statement that he would renounce the office of Bishop of Rome at 8pm on 28 February.

He says a conclave will have to be convened to elect the new pope.

And he says he wishes to continue to serve the church "through a life dedicated to prayer".

Well I guess Wikipedia has news sources that we don't. LOL

In 1045, Pope Benedict IX agreed, for financial advantage, to resign the papacy. Pope Gregory VI, who to rid the Church of the scandalous Benedict IX had persuaded him to resign, became his successor. Gregory himself resigned in 1046 because the arrangement he had entered into with Benedict was considered simoniacal; that is, to have been paid for. Gregory's successor, Pope Clement II, died in 1047 and Benedict IX became Pope again.

The best known example of the resignation of a Pope is that of Pope Celestine V in 1294. After only five months of pontificate, he issued a solemn decree declaring it permissible for a Pope to resign, and then did so himself. He lived two more years as a hermit and was later canonized. The Papal decree that he issued ended any doubt among canonists about the possibility of a valid Papal resignation.

Pope Gregory XII (1406-1415), resigned in order to end the Western Schism, which had reached the point where there were three claimants to the Papal throne, Roman Pope Gregory XII, Avignon Antipope Benedict XIII, and Pisan Antipope John XXIII. Before resigning he formally convened the already existing Council of Constance and authorized it to elect his successor.

On 11 February 2013, the Vatican announced that Pope Benedict XVI would resign effective February 28, 2013. The Pope said, in a statement, that he could not continue due to his advanced age.[4] He is the first pope to resign in over 600 years.

**********************************************************

Advanced age sounds a little flimsy to me, John Paul was older than the hills and he stuck with it till death, he just cut down on duties.

I think he's just resigned from the Papacy, not the Catholic Church, he'll still be a priest. But then again, who knows, this is pretty unheard of!

now he is free to do anything at his will?

The last pope to resign was Pope Gregory XII, who stepped down in 1415 in a deal to end the Great Western Schism among competing papal claimants

Good for him, now he can indulge more in designer brands :)

I'm shocked. I didn't know you could even resign from the Papacy. I wonder what he got caught doing?

Very strange, must be hard being a Pope being an ex Nazi youth member and presiding over the biggest child sex abuse scandal in history. (Oh and while a Bishop help cover it up)

Yeah I never heard a religious leader resigns from his post. I am not talking about politicians..

Obviously there is more to this than meets the eye!

He will be the first head of the Catholic Church to resign in almost 600 years. The Vatican said his departure would leave the post temporarily vacant.

Does God's emissary on earth, simply decides to resign? Is God an employer with disgruntled staff members?

Source Al Jazeera