Students to be taught there's no God
AAP December 14, 2008: VICTORIAN state primary school students will soon be able to take religious education classes which teach there is no evidence God exists.
The Humanist Society of Victoria has developed a curriculum for primary pupils that the state government accreditation body says it intends to approve, The Sunday Age newspaper reported.
Accredited volunteers will be able to teach their philosophy in the class time allotted for religious instruction, the newspaper said.
As with lessons delivered by faith groups, parents will be able to request that their children do not participate.
"Atheistical parents will be pleased to hear that humanistic courses of ethics will soon be available in some state schools," Victorian Humanist Society president Stephen Stuart said.
The society does not consider itself to be a religious organisation and believes ethics have "no necessary connection with religion".
Humanists believe people are responsible for their own destiny and reject the notion of a supernatural force or God.
Refreshing to know that students/parents get a choice these days.
Sag, Quran verses need substantial explanation in simple language for such people to understand in its true sense and right meaning/purpose.
Victor,
'Hope I answered your question.'
I didn't ask you any question but just promoting rational thinking. Most of the Quran has contextual matter but taking it literally is what most believers do today and this is due to immature minds being exposed to religion.
agree that in Schools, children have unmoulded flexible brains and could make a proper shape about the World and Religion; which would be difficult to re-shape when they grew up. This will turn into the hard-core attitude and in-built values for rest of their lives.
One need to get proper education with Open Forum to think in all directions including Gypsy's Atheist view. One need to search for an answer rather justifying or thrusting personal opinion on others.
If you discuss all religions, however,if you discuss all religions you also need to discuss the argument of the non-existence of God.
Keith If you look at the ethos of what they are teaching, it is very similar to what you are saying, its covered in the ethics.
smile lots laugh more
Well said.. Agree with your comments.
When I was at school we had friday assembly with the Local minister. As I remember everybody attended regardless of religion. Interestingly she never spoke about religion but Faith. Now that I look back and think on it a common point was our Commonality, not our minor differences of race , religion , colour. Very clever indeed ,and this was in the 60s. Now having travelled a bit in my life I have come to think that it would be far more benneficial in schools to share everybodies religions which I think would propogate greater understanding from an early age and the appreciation that we all have far more in common with each other and really very few differences .
Being a muslim; one should know that what Quran mentioned about Jews and Christians, was based on their past relationship with Muslims and religious bond between Christians and Jews (Jesus and Moses).
Christians can be your good friends but Jews are back stabbers; look at the current affairs even today it is proved.
Jews were punished many a times due to their own mis-deeds (they even killed their messengers) and Christians are mis-leaded by Jews (long story). Hope I answered your question.
That's good for your peace of mind Nicaq. Don't come to this threads again. You know I am a muslim and I want to believe. I do pray and fast. It really pains me to talk against the existence of God. But there is a need for believers to think rationally and you do this by submitting your purpose to God...
there is only one truth I know. That there is GOd and He exists. You can go ahead with your- reasoning, philosophy,research, science or what have you, but as for me, I am comfortable with my faith and that alone give me peace of mind. No further argument from my side. Peace be with you all!
I am now confused. It's like, 'who comes first? God or the Universe? So weird. I try not to read those posts that contradict the existence of God. I'm sorry, I can take what the faith of Islam is trying to tell me, but not those who does not believe God.
RS: 'Buddha' doesnt look like anything coz Buddha is not a person, its a state of being. Ofcourse there are people who knew what Siddharta looked like.
nicaq: Which one did you order first? Chicken or Egg?
:-p
this will bring us to 'who comes first? chicken or egg?'
Zen Buddhism is something that has always made a lot of sense to me... In fact there was this Zen master who had said, "If you meet Buddha , kill him!!"
Because the Buddha you meet/assimiliate is not the true Buddha, but an expression of your longing. If this Buddha is not killed he will only stand in your way. killing the Buddha is a metaphor for moving past the complacency of belief, for struggling honestly with the idea of God.
When you kill the idea/image you have formed in your mind about what should be, only then you will be able to see what IS.
Just because there are a lot of questions that we, at present, do not have answers doesnot mean that we should use the concept of "God" as a skeleton key.
Human progress is heavily indebted to those who refused to accept the 'status quo', refused to accept what their clergy/religion told them was right and explored where their fancy took em.
Well Victor consider this:
If the statement that 'God exists and He revealed Quran' is perfect and there is no doubt in it then there is no way that I respect those who reject God or His revelation for Quran itself says that don't take Jew and Christians as your friends. There comes the need for the expression 'There is no evidence that God exists'.
When I say Quran I am not just refering to Islam but its in general any religion. All believers should be aware of this lest there will be no peace..
us into the circle of 'Which comes from which, the water came from the clouds or the clouds came from the water' ...
We know for sure that 'The Soul' of someone is the only thing that keeps him/her alive, the moment it leaves the body that person is considered officially dead.
It leaves the body to where? No one knows ..
What was it made of? No answer I guess ..
Can we see it or touch it? No one did as far as i know ..
Many questions without answers, and some questions got no answers at all ...
Do not dwell in the past, do not dream of the future, concentrate the mind on the present moment. (Gautama Buddha)
That would only make sense if people who were religious didn't suffer hardship. However if you look at some of the most religious countries and peoples in the world many of them are suffering from poverty, disease, starvation, etc. So that argument doesn't hold water either.
THREE QUESTIONS
There was a young man who went overseas to study for a quite a long time. When he returned, he asked his parents to find him a religious scholar or any expert who could answer his 3 Questions. Finally, his parents were able to find a Muslim scholar.
Young Man Says: I have 3 Questions:
Question # 1 Does God Exist? If so, show me his shape.
Question # 2 What is Taqdeer (Fate)?
Question # 3 If shaitan (Devil) was created from the fire, why at the end he will be thrown to hell that is also created from fire. It certainly will not hurt him at all, since shaitan & the hell were created from Fire.
Did God Think of this far?
Suddenly, the Scholar slapped the young man’s face very hard. Young man (Felt Pain): why do you get angry at me?
Allah said: “If you are ashamed of me, I will be ashamed of you.” If you are not ashamed, pass this message on…only If you believe…
Yes, I love Allah, Allah is my fountain of Life and My Savior. Allah keeps me going day & night. Without Allah, I am no one, but with Allah, I can do everything. Allah is my strength. May HE help U to Succeed.. Ameen
ALLAH DOES EXIST…
This is one of the best explanations of why Allah allows pain and suffering that I have seen:
A man went to a Barbershop to have his hair cut and his beard trimmed. As the barber began to work, they began to have a good conversation. They talked about so many things and various subjects when they eventually touched on the subject of Allah
The Barber said: I don’t believe that Allah Exists. Why do you say that? Asked the customer. Well, you just have to go out in the street & realize that Allah doesn’t exist. Tell me if Allah Exists, would there be so many sick people?
Would there be abandoned Children? If Allah existed, there would be neither suffering nor pain. I can’t imagine a loving Allah who would allow all of these things. The customer thought for a moment, but didn’t respond because he didn’t want to start an argument.
The Barber finished his job and the customer left the shop. Just after he left the barbershop, he saw a man in the street with long, stringy, dirty hair and untrimmed beard, he looked dirty and unkempt.
The customer turned back and entered the barbershop again and said to the barber: You know what? Barbers do not exist. How can you say that? Asked the surprised Barber. I am here, and I am a Barber, & I just worked on you!
No! The customer exclaimed. “Barbers don’t exist because if they did, there would be no people with dirty long hair and untrimmed beard, like that man outside.
Ah, But Barbers do exist! That’s what happens when people do not come to me.” Exactly, affirmed the customer. “that’s the Point!
Allah, too, exist! That’s what happens when people do not go to HIM and don’t look to HIM for Help. That’s why there’s so much pain and suffering in the World”.
IF YOU THINK ALLAH EXISTS, SEND THIS TO OTHER PEOPLE, BUT IF YOU THINK ALLAH DOES NOT EXIST, DELETE IT! BE BLESSED & BE A BLESSING UNTO OTHERS!!!
The answer KE is we don't know 100% for sure yet, but if you look at how much we've found out about the origins of life, atoms, molecules etc in the last decade and imagine how much more will find out in the coming decades, then someday we just might know.
Physisist will tell you 'from nothing'. King. However, teir 'nothing' and your 'nothing' are totally different.
the world who created us human in this shape and form? From where did we come to this life? Now don't give me the 'My Parents' answer or be more specific and tell me from where did you exactly came :S
Do not dwell in the past, do not dream of the future, concentrate the mind on the present moment. (Gautama Buddha)
And pick up the philosophies and books that were written before the Quran, and you'll see that it simply furthers what has already been theorized.
Why I said Read Quran or old testament of Bible bcoz it is providing full support and helping advancements to scientist in their researches always
What ever we have found today it has been written long back in these books but you need to have an analyser view; pick up any current invention or discovery and you will find the relationship which was already mention in these books.
lol Tallg muslims in srilanka think the prophet had been in the island. :) now that is new to me.
How was he enlightened tallg? and who enlightened him?any idea
Poverty is not for the sake of hardship. No, it is there because nothing exists but God. Poverty unlocks the door -- what a blessed key!
- Jalaluddin al-Rumi
Sri Lanka :)
do we know how buddha looked like? did he had human feet? can we see the footprints :)
Poverty is not for the sake of hardship. No, it is there because nothing exists but God. Poverty unlocks the door -- what a blessed key!
- Jalaluddin al-Rumi
Is Adam an expert in this field ???
Yaaawn......:(
Can i get a cup of Lizard Tongue Soup Plz...:(
Off to see the Adam peek tomorrow.. Will ask the Budhist monk about this question on my two week trip to Sri Lanka..
Anyway all of you be good to each other..
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HE WHO DARES WINS
Brit you mean believing kids or their parents?
Kids should be taught all options Let them use their God given brains to fetch the truth instead of forcing on them something..
well em is it not enough for kids that religions teach the existence of God. I said along with religion not without religion..
"There is no evidence that there is God" - there is also no evidence that there is NO God.
Many things can be proven scientifically but others cannot. That's why belief in God is by faith. The Qur'an and the Bible are not books of science but rather, of signs.
/Yes, realsomeone - continue to share so we can learn from each other and broaden our minds.
*****************************************
Don't want no drama,
No, no drama, no, no, no, no drama
what book are you referring that teaches the world as "flat". If you are referring to Bible, definitely, you are wrong. So it's those who don't understand the book before that says the world is flat, but not the book!
"dgoodrebel will always be the rebellious good one"
MR PAUL i accept that everybody doesnt feel the way i do. but sharing information is always a good thing and that is what i am doing.
Poverty is not for the sake of hardship. No, it is there because nothing exists but God. Poverty unlocks the door -- what a blessed key!
- Jalaluddin al-Rumi
yer just accept that not everybody feels the same way that you do, about religion....
"A man may fight for many things.His country,his friends,his principles,the glistening tear on the cheek of a golden child.
But personally,I'd mud wrestle my own mother for a ton of cash, an amusing clock and a sackful of porn."
Blackadder.
We let each other believe what we feel is correct, till proven otherwise..
So, going back to the original post, "Belivers" may opt out of taking these classes.
zag and gypy read this other thread of mine http://www.qatarliving.com/node/294953#new
Poverty is not for the sake of hardship. No, it is there because nothing exists but God. Poverty unlocks the door -- what a blessed key!
- Jalaluddin al-Rumi
200 hundred years ago we thought the body was controlled by the heart, we now, thanks to advancement in technology know it's the brain...so who's to say 200 hundred years from now we will technology won't have advanced to the point that we will be able to find out the truth of creation? Be it atom, molecule or what have you. The point is to keep searching for the truth and continue questioning rather then believe everything written in a book 1600 years ago. If we did that, again, we'd believe the Earth was flat.
Lo realsomeone is another example of children being exposed to unexplained matter!! Theres no harm in believing., but you need to keep it to yourself...
There is nothing wrong in telling the truth that there is no evidence of the existence of God along with the what religions say. that will give kids ability to reason what they want to believe..
because you don't know who built the house in the forest, you won't believe there is God. Crazy idea. And no wonder what is happening in our world today?
"dgoodrebel will always be the rebellious good one"
sag what evidence do you need ??? do you think a house can build itself?
Poverty is not for the sake of hardship. No, it is there because nothing exists but God. Poverty unlocks the door -- what a blessed key!
- Jalaluddin al-Rumi
Science believe that with the natural process it happened..but there is somebody WHO is on Driving Seat my friend...make this process to happen...
the existence of a god....
"A man may fight for many things.His country,his friends,his principles,the glistening tear on the cheek of a golden child.
But personally,I'd mud wrestle my own mother for a ton of cash, an amusing clock and a sackful of porn."
Blackadder.
Yes, its built by someone but there could be no evidence that who built it. Again you have to believe someone built it!!
If you see a house in the forest, will you think that it just came about there or you would think that somebody built it? So, who built this world we live in?
"dgoodrebel will always be the rebellious good one"
I think Asif here is a good example of a kid being taught about God at very elemetary level. It happens in muslim nations.
I think its because its who he is and his power that we cannot totally describe...because as humans we need to explain things with example but there is nothing like him and he isnt like humans or his creations but he gave us enough information for us to know about him and that is through his books.
Poverty is not for the sake of hardship. No, it is there because nothing exists but God. Poverty unlocks the door -- what a blessed key!
- Jalaluddin al-Rumi
RS thanks.. Is it because God only gave us so much Intelect that we could only think, feel, believe so much about our creator (again a matter of Faith). Even though he made us the best of his creation, yet still he did not give us enough ability to really describe him and his Characteristics only the one he has taight us.
Well we can only say that he controls us and we will never be able to know fully his capabilities I suppose..
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HE WHO DARES WINS
UKeng...from my point of view God exists because I feel God through everything I do and I see. just look the sky and you will see thousands of evidences that God exists.
Tell me why you believe Love exists? is it touchable..because most atheists arguments comes to i cant see. can you see love?
Poverty is not for the sake of hardship. No, it is there because nothing exists but God. Poverty unlocks the door -- what a blessed key!
- Jalaluddin al-Rumi
i not a surprise. Everybody will be given due espect. But I agree that religion should relegated to parents, at home and in church and not in schools specifically public schools wherein it is funded by the state.
Consequences of such action is easily recognizable in a certain time while belief on God (whatever your conviction is) will be recognized only comes judgment day and nobody among us now will say who really is correct! Because by that time, the good will be in heaven and the opposite will be in hell. It's laways your choice and conviction!
"dgoodrebel will always be the rebellious good one"
HE (GOD)is the ONE who is self sustained and ALWAYS THERE...I know science will never accept THEORY OF SELF EXISTENCE...
We are very small and our human brains / mind has certain limitations and unable to even think HOW Big and Mighty He is, WHO is running the whole universe and will make everybody accountable for his deeds.
With sincere determination Read Religious books like Quran, old testatments of bible....that will surely give you the answers what your 5 years old child have asked.
To WINN: During olden days, it was believed that Heart was an epicenter; which managed all your actions and NOT brain!
The 'causal' way of thinking became obsolete when quantum mechanics was formulated. Things happen without reason.
RS is it blasphamey to ask about these questions? From your point of view explain to me that God exists..
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HE WHO DARES WINS
You got MANY FORMS AND SHAPES OF GOD and I got theology classes for your brain... What in the hell, did i just said?
The Red_Pope is the next goodwill Ambassador to the UN.
This is crap..they will die trying to run from the evidence of God and burn in hell.
Poverty is not for the sake of hardship. No, it is there because nothing exists but God. Poverty unlocks the door -- what a blessed key!
- Jalaluddin al-Rumi
Not a difficult one..
I shall be happy to explain this to your youngster whenever needed...
Science does not say that heart is the epicentre. Heart is just a pump, a very versatile one at that!
What about the creator of the creator and omnipotent? If nothing can exist without a creator, then who created the creator?
Brit thank about the mother nature thing.. Ok God created them all. But one question I can not answer was asked by my 5 year old daughter..
WHO CREATED GOD?????
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HE WHO DARES WINS
OMG, I need to take my biology and physics science classes again...anyways agrees that professor has a brain; when did we realise this hundred or 2 hundred years back.
Prior to that everybody thought that Heart is the controller (epicentre) of your life and if heart stop working you are dead;
Now clinically it is proven that if brain stop working a man is clinically dead even though his heart is beating (generally in COMA cases). I do agree that there are certain scenarios where science and its great technology could not prove what they claim.
Similarly we always find (see around) that Faith is Mightier than Reality.
BTW: Let me very clear that it is all about once FAITH and everybody should try and search for his CREATOR and identify the SUPERNATURAL and the OMNIPOTENT.
Don't forget your wet towel...and remeber when you see the dolphins doing their triple back flips and saying so long and thanks for all the fish...it's time to start hitching......
"Your born, You Live, You Die, given this premise, one can conclude since we have no control over when we are born and when we die, the only thing that matters to us should be how we live, simple really?" Mis-Cat to her philosophy Lecturer.
i understand clearly what you say.. Thanks for the warning.. i'll try and hitch Hike my way out of here..
No one can argue against the babel fish.....anyway the vogons are coming to destroy the earth to make way for the super galactic highway or so I've heard.....
"Your born, You Live, You Die, given this premise, one can conclude since we have no control over when we are born and when we die, the only thing that matters to us should be how we live, simple really?" Mis-Cat to her philosophy Lecturer.
"The society does not consider itself to be a religious organisation and believes ethics have "no necessary connection with religion".....Bang on!!
Victor:About heat and cold
This is where you resort to the Einstein's Theory of relativity which simply states that nothing is absolute, everything is relative.
When you say something is x meters long, it means the thing is x times longer than the standard meter which has been defined as "the length of a metal rod kept in some institute in paris at Standard temperature and pressure." It is "relative" to something else.
When you say temperature is 25 degrees you have to say whether its Fahrenheit or Kelvin/Celsius without which it doesn't make sense!
This concept again has got nothing to do with god, but the student is only using it to oppose the principal's concept of duality. Again the student doesn't say anything about good and evil. He is only opposing that with arguments about heat and cold (which even science calls relative) to oppose the concept of duality without addressing the professor's question of good and evil, god and Satan!
Technically speaking, Humans didn't come from monkeys, as in; a monkey did not give birth to a human being one fine morning. But we belong to primates and followed the same evolution process. If you check the DNA of a chimpanzee, it is 98.4% similar to those of human beings. The theory of evolution is still under debate(meaning there are a lot of scientists who are sceptic about some postulates of the theory). So the professor was not teaching his opinion (as the student surmised), he was teaching a theory, or one of the theories rather, which tries to explain evolution. No scientist will ever say that Darvin's theory is the final answer to the question of evolution. It is a theory based on study of a lot of species around the world, which took Mr. Darvin 30 yrs of his life in the ship called H.M.S Beagle. (It did not take the clergy much time to call it blasphemy without even bothering to see what it said.) Study of fossils, volcanic, oceanic and geographic data, study of cellular molecular structure of a large variety of species existing and extinct all point their fingers at evolution.
If you could discover things only with your five senses we would be much backward than we are now. A good chunk of science deals with hypothesis and assumptions rather than the five senses. How else do you forecast weather, solar and lunar eclipses? Atoms n molecules were talked about much before the invention of microscopes and such. There are things in science which are purely based on calculations, extrapolation of available data and assumptions.
BUT THE DIFFERANCE IS THAT NOTHING IS BASED ON PURE FAITH.
Galileo/Copernicus did not say that earth was not the centre of universe by going into outer space! If we had depended only on what faith told us, people might still believe that sun goes around earth!!
In fact most of the things that science has proved are not directly related to five senses.
The students question about the professor's brain can be adequately answered by a scan/EEG. Student says, "ACCORDING TO THE ESTABLISHED RULES OF EMPIRICAL, STABLE, DEMONSTRABLE PROTOCOL, SCIENCE SAYS THAT YOU HAVE NO BRAIN, SIR"
Wrong!! Demonstrable protocol will definitely agree that the professor has a brain. You don't even need a scan/EEG if you are following a demonstrable protocol to prove the existence of professor's brain
Principles of duality or the five senses are not things that can prove or disprove existence of god. They can only be used to use as premises to argue without really touching the subject. Here the professor's premises are wrong and the student is only opposing those premises without proving anything about the existence/non-existence of god.
You heathens can Poo-Poo the majesty of mother nature, the hills, trees, rivers, streams, man and even the ability to reproduce as signs of the existence of God, but surely you cannot argue against the Babel fish ..
Flan is back here any way....
but agree with Gypsy on the anecdote as towards the end the argument is lost... as any debate using philosophy can then argue that given premise 1. that the professor is human, premise 2. that science has provided factual evidence that all humans have a brain (this does not mean that all humans use it ) premise 3. premise one and two are known Truths
there fore the professor has a brain.
there fore the last part of the anecdote and argument is false.
"Your born, You Live, You Die, given this premise, one can conclude since we have no control over when we are born and when we die, the only thing that matters to us should be how we live, simple really?" Mis-Cat to her philosophy Lecturer.
Let everybody on Earth should be given opportunity to identify and search for true Creator of this universe....rather putting them in ONE bracket or thought!
Sorry Brit. The Earth is round. Bit of a bummer I know.
You mean the earth is not flat ??? I can drive to australasia and visit Flan and see that silly looking duck billed platypus??
Double post!
"With all due respect, sir, how do we then trust your lectures, sir?"
You shouldn't. The first thing any good teacher or university, especially, will teach you is critical thinking and to question everything. If we all just trusted our teachers the world would still be flat, which is why this whole anecdote is ridiculous.
Glad to see that you agree with my earlier posting..
Its all about FAITH!
Prof: Is God all-powerful?
Student: Yes.
Prof: My brother died of cancer even though he prayed to God to heal him.
Most of us would attempt to help others who are ill. But God didn't. How is this God good then? Hmm? (Student is silent.)
Prof: You can't answer, can you? Let's start again, young fellow. Is God
good?
Student: Yes.
Prof: Is Satan good ?
Student: No.
Prof: Where does Satan come from?
Student: From...God.. .
Prof: That's right. Tell me son, is there evil in this world?
Student: Yes.
Prof: Evil is everywhere, isn't it? And God did make everything. Correct?
Student: Yes.
Prof: So who created evil?
(Student does not answer. )
Prof: Is there sickness? Immorality? Hatred? Ugliness? All these terrible things exist in the world, don't they?
Student: Yes, sir.
Prof: So, who created them?
( Student has no answer.)
Prof: Science says you have 5 senses you use to identify and observe the
world around you. Tell me, son...Have you ever seen God?
Student: No, sir.
Prof: Tell us if you have ever heard your God?
Student: No, sir.
Prof: Have you ever felt your God, tasted your God, smelt your God? Have you ever had any sensory perception of God for that matter?
Student: No, sir. I'm afraid I haven't.
Prof: Yet you still believe in Him ?
Student: Yes.
Prof: According to empirical, testable, demonstrable protocol, science says your GOD doesn't exist. What do you say to that, son?
Student: Nothing. I only have my faith.
Prof: Yes. Faith. And that is the problem science has.
Student: Professor, is there such a thing as heat?
Prof: Yes.
Student: And is there such a thing as cold?
Prof: Yes.
Student: No sir. There isn't.
(The lecture theatre becomes very quiet with this turn of events .)
Student: Sir, you can have lots of heat, even more heat, superheat, mega heat, white heat, a little heat or no heat. But we don't have anything called cold. We can hit 458 degrees below zero which is no heat,
But we can't go any further after that. There is no such thing as cold. Cold
is only a word we use to describe the absence of heat. We cannot measure cold.
Heat is energy. Cold is not the opposite of heat, sir, just the absence of it.
(There is pin-drop silence in the lecture theatre .)
Student: What about darkness, Professor? Is there such a thing as darkness?
Prof: Yes. What is night if there isn't darkness?
Student: You're wrong again, sir. Darkness is the absence of something. You can have low light, normal light, bright light, flashing light....But if you
have no light constantly, you have nothing and its called darkness, isn't it? In reality, darkness isn't.
If it were you would be able to make darkness darker, wouldn't you?
Prof: So what is the point you are making, young man?
Student: Sir, my point is your philosophical premise is flawed.
Prof: Flawed? Can you explain how?
Student: Sir, you are working on the premise of duality. You argue there is
life and then there is death, a good God and a bad God. You are viewing the
concept of God as something finite, something we can measure.
Sir, science can't even explain a thought. It uses electricity and
magnetism, but has never seen, much less fully understood either one.
To view death as the opposite of life is to be ignorant of the fact that death cannot exist as a substantive thing. Death is not the opposite of life: just the absence of it. Now tell me, Professor. Do you teach your
students that they evolved from a monkey?
Prof: If you are referring to the natural evolutionary process, yes, of course, I do.
Student: Have you ever observed evolution with your own eyes, sir?
(The Professor shakes his head with a smile, beginning to realize where the argument is going.)
Student: Since no one has ever observed the process of evolution at work and
cannot even prove that this process is an on-going endeavour, are you not teaching your opinion, sir? Are you not a scientist but a preacher?
(The class is in uproar .)
Student: Is there anyone in the class who has ever seen the Professor's brain?
(The class breaks out into laughter.)
Student: Is there anyone here who has ever heard the Professor's brain, felt
it, touched or smelt it? No one appears to have done so. So, according to the established rules of empirical, stable, demonstrable protocol, science
says that you have no brain, sir.
With all due respect, sir, how do we then trust your lectures, sir?
(The room is silent . The professor stares at the student, his face
unfathomable.)
Prof: I guess you'll have to take them on faith, son.
Student: That is it sir... The link between man & god is FAITH .
That is all that keeps things moving & alive
see next comment
jiyad, says who?
Nothing in this universe can be created without a creator...Nothing exists by its own....Look at the planets, the moon,the sun...........all these things a human cant even imagine to create.......after all There is an all mighty power behind all these things.....Who is the only ONE....
it will be a philosophically based curriculum..one that is based on the philosophical argument that "there is no tangible proof (proof in this case being that, other than what religious texts tell us to be true) of the existence of god then god cannot exist...It will also teach ethics and how to make a decision based on ethics, being that ethics in philosophical principal devoid of any emotive issue and an outcome that is based on the greater good.
"Your born, You Live, You Die, given this premise, one can conclude since we have no control over when we are born and when we die, the only thing that matters to us should be how we live, simple really?" Mis-Cat to her philosophy Lecturer.
There is no God, so science is simply the study of the natural world.
God is not science, and so science is not God.
God created science, so how can science be superior to the one who created it?
And yes-Faith is best understood by those who believes it. It will be useless to argue for those who do not.
One common thing I noticed though, in Islam they believed in Allah, and so are Christians believed in God.
I see no problem with this at all. Finally there will be options besides the constant barrage of the God Squad.
Have a great time in Sri lanka..
All religions are based on faith. Scientific proof is not required. We could argue about the rights or wrongs of this till the cows come home..
Suffice to say - "Faith is to believe what you do not see; the reward of this faith is to see what you believe."
Thanks Brit, Got back from Pakistan on Thursday and off tomorrow to Sri Lanka for two weeks with the wife and daugthers who arrived fom London on Friday. When you off to cold and wet sky's of UK?
Yes getting back to the Topic. Now FAITH is a big word. I remember some one telling me that Believe is some ting othrerwise you will end up believing in every t thing.
I think scientificaly we may never be able to prove there is God?
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HE WHO DARES WINS
Welcome back.. Glad you had a nice break..
The simple answer is FAITH.... Needs no scientific evidence..
For all of you who believe that God exists. Please can you give you evidence. Facts please not beliefs. How do you define God in Science with evidence, or is Human too weak to understand the existence of God??
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HE WHO DARES WINS
"religion is the opium of the masses"
Religious suffering is, at one and the same time, the expression of real suffering and a protest against real suffering. Religion is the sigh of the oppressed creature, the heart of a heartless world, and the soul of soulless conditions. It is the opium of the people.
He who dies with the most toys wins.
Thanks for adding such a well thought out argument to this debate.
Your contribution is highly valued.
Do you want to now respond to the initial question?
i say the truth. i stand for god the allah all mighty who created u me and the whole universe.
Yes... God is love....
And I love people who have room in their heart to both love God, and hate anyone who disagrees with them.
asif_khan,love.......go to bed, this is adult time now....
if there is no god then how was the world created?
how was everything in the universe came to existence?
i hate people who say that there is no god?
If Atheism is a religion, culture will come from it. And what culture will emanate on a basis of a god not existing?
It's best that atheism be taught in Philosophy classes than in religion classes.
And God! (again) in elementary schools? Too early.
"Everything in this book may be wrong." Illusions: The Adventures of The Reluctant Messiah by Richard Bach
Probably a peacefull well balanced culture is the answer to that
just eat another pie
rami, they don't teach "that there is no God", they teach that "there is no evidence that there is God", which is perfectly legal.
Agree with Brit and rami, personally state funded schools should teach history of different types of religions as a subject, and tolerance of other peoples. faiths. rami is right, this is no different than teaching there is a god.
Religious instruction classes should be left to private religious schools if parents want too send their kids to learn about a specific teachings of one religion.
THat is great... They will learn the first part of the shahada... Now who wants to teach them the rest?
They call it the American dream because you have to be asleep to see it... --George Carlin
I don't think there's a place for religious instruction in state funded schools.
Having said that, I agree with Brit Expat - students should learn 'about' religions (as opposed to receiving religious instruction) at school - Judaism, Christianity, Buddhism, Islam - the whole lot.
I disgree with teaching that there is no god - that is no different from teaching that there is a god, in that neither view can really be proved or disproved.
My God! (Still love to push that expression)
"Everything in this book may be wrong." Illusions: The Adventures of The Reluctant Messiah by Richard Bach
mmmm i'm no fan of the God Squad at all but this is quite innapropriate. Scripture was always my favourite lesson at school because it taught me to question and think why? how? etc etc and it was always one that would send me to sleep.....
not teaching religion is different from teaching students the non-existence of God!
Heero: Why my own school? To teach kids to be racional all i need is a non religious school
Only God Can Judge Me
الله فقط يمكنه محاكمتي
I am you and you are me, if you love i love, if you suffer i suffer
أنا أنت, و أنت أنا, إذا أحببت نفسك أحببت نفسي, إذا عانيتَ عانيتُ
I personaly believe that the "opt out" does more damage than good. Why not have a "mandatory" R.E class , which teaches all major religions, plus Atheism..
even muslims will not agree to this notion. It simply implying, no God, no Allah, no Almighty,no Creator?
That's totally absurd!
"Everything in this book may be wrong." Illusions: The Adventures of The Reluctant Messiah by Richard Bach