The Dogmatic and the Secular
Compare and contrast.
One makes sense and gives everyone a choice to practice their religion without affecting others, the other is just crazy bat sh*t! Not hard to distinguish the two.
See the link for the photo of the Police poster and sorry it's so long.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1030798/Muslims-outraged-police-...
1) A postcard featuring a cute puppy sitting in a policeman's hat advertising a Scottish police force's new telephone number has sparked outrage from Muslims.
Tayside Police's new non-emergency phone number has prompted complaints from members of the Islamic community.
The choice of image on the Tayside Police cards - a black dog sitting in a police officer's hat - has now been raised with Chief Constable John Vine.
Poster
Tayside Police caused uproar in the Muslim community after they released this advertisement featuring police puppy Rebel sitting in a hat
The advert has upset Muslims because dogs are considered ritually unclean and has sparked such anger that some shopkeepers in Dundee have refused to display the advert.
Dundee councillor Mohammed Asif said: 'My concern was that it's not welcomed by all communities, with the dog on the cards.
'It was probably a waste of resources going to these communities.
'They (the police) should have understood. Since then, the police have explained that it was an oversight on their part, and that if they'd seen it was going to cause upset they wouldn't have done it.'
Councillor Asif, who is a member of the Tayside Joint Police Board, said that the force had a diversity adviser and was generally very aware of such issues.
He raised the matter with Mr Vine at a meeting of the board.
John Vine
Tayside Police Chief Constable John Vine said the advert was not intended to cause any offence
The chief constable said he was unaware of the concerns and that the force had not sought to cause any upset but added he would look into the matter.
Councillor Asif said: 'People who have shops just won't put up the postcard. But the police have said to me that it was simply an oversight and they did not seek to offend or upset.'
Cards featuring police dog-in-training Rebel have been distributed to communities throughout the area to advertise the single number point of contact for non-emergency calls to the police.
Rebel has proved a popular recruit for Tayside Police after coming through the very first Lothian and Borders Police dog-breeding programme in February.
One of seven German Shepherd pups born in early December, he has now completed his course of inoculations, and is free to venture out onto the streets of Tayside.
A spokesman for Tayside Police said: 'Trainee police dog Rebel has proved extremely popular with children and adults since being introduced to the public, aged six weeks old, as Tayside Police's newest canine recruit.
'His incredible world-wide popularity - he has attracted record visitor numbers to our website - led us to believe Rebel could play a starring role in the promotion of our non-emergency number.
'We did not seek advice from the force's diversity adviser prior to publishing and distributing the postcards. That was an oversight and we apologise for any offence caused.'
http://blogs.independent.co.uk/openhouse/2008/07/it-can-be-right.html#more
2) There is a surprising - and encouraging - gap in the government's new Equality Bill, which I columnized on yesterday. Discrimination on the basis of age, race, gender and sexuality will be outlawed - but not discrimination on the basis of religion. When I saw this, I gave a loud atheist cheer. A religion is a set of man-made superstitions, and I reserve my right to discriminate against anybody silly enough to choose to believe them.
You don't choose your race, sexuality, or gender, and they don't affect how well you do your job. But you do choose your religion - and there are instances in which it will make it impossible for you to do a job properly. If you are a burqua-wearing Muslim, you can't enter Miss Great Britain. If you are an Orthodox Jew who refuses to look women in the eye or make physical contact with them, you can't be a beautician. If you are an evangelical Christian, you can't work in a gay club. Go work somewhere else, or change your silly beliefs.
Recently a 19 year old Muslim girl called Bushra Noah applied for a job at a hairdressers where the staff showed off their hairstyles, for obvious reasons. She refused to - she wears a headscarf - so she was told the job just wasn't for her. She sued, and was rewarded £4000. This is ridiculous. If you choose to wear a headscarf, that's absolutely your right - but it means you are choosing not to work in a trendy salon.
Of course there are instances of much uglier discrimination. In July 2004, the BBC conducted an experiment: they sent out nearly identical job applications to over fifty British employers. The applicants with Anglo-Saxon names were twice as likely to be asked to interview as those with Muslim names. This obviously repels me. But is this religious discrimination - or racial? If those application had Hindu names, would they have been accepted? Are there all these bigots out there saying, "I hate those Muslims ' but I love Sikhs?" Of course not. This is anti-Asian prejudice irrespective of faith, and it should be dealt with by laws banning racial discrimination.
Besides, granting "religious rights" would actually undercut all the other rights in the Equality Bill, because religions often command discrimination against women and gay people. I gave an example last year in a column about the police:
Last year the Labour government introduced new equality legislation making it a crime to discriminate against gay people in the workplace [but] the government simultaneously introduced laws guaranteeing "religious rights." These have been pounced upon by religious homophobes, who insist that their "right to religious belief" includes their right to loudly hate gay people who happen to work alongside them… Whenever homophobia is exposed in a police station, the offending officers now plead that they are just following their religion and that is the end of that. Religion has become a get-out-of-jail-free card for homophobic officers… While obviously individuals have to be free to be homophobic in their homes in their spare time, when they are working for us, they have to treat us all equally.
If you are for human rights, then you have to be against amorphous and toxic "religious rights."
Maybe i will pop in and say hello.
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NIL ILLEGITIMI CARBORUNDUM
well .. the veggie example was just to attempt to show a difference between two positions. The meat eater needs to restrict his choices in the presence of the vegetarian, but the vegetarian will not restrict her choices in his presence. That's what I meant.
Nigel...quite agree with you on whts happening in UK. Someone really needs to put their foot down or in a decade or so you will be following a totally different legal system even!! (Yeah...its ur country, n they shud b respecting ur customs n traditions).
That said, I cannot quite identify with the veggie-nonveg example u gave. I have veggie frnds n I know that they hav become veggies coz they jus cant stand the smell of meat. But I dont hav any problems with how the vegetarian dishes smell(most non-vegetarians dont) so I can give em a salad but they cant gimme a steak coz it'll b too much trbl for them. I Dont find any double standards in that.
Have some fun:
&feature=related
All stories in these articles are verified. Believe me there is a small minority of muslims in the UK that take perceived victimhood to such a height that it qualifies as an art form.
"Deaths in the Bible. God - 2,270,365
not including the victims of Noah's flood, Sodom and Gomorrah, or the
many plagues, famines, fiery serpents, etc because no specific numbers
were given. Satan - 10."
Everynow and then i read this story of muslims in west outraged at something very silly, even things that no one will bother about in a muslim country.
I am skeptic about these stories.
Actually I can believe the Scottish police bending over backwards to apologise over something so pathetic. They are only really good at pandering to silly minorities or catching drivers speeding in a 30mph zone. When it comes to teenage yobs or street crime, or just speaking plain common sense on a matter, they are nowhere to be seen.
On the puppy-in-the-postcard case, whatever happened to the "it's their country, respect its customs and traditions" that we foreigners tolerate on a daily basis in this part of the world? Why must these people be so easily offended? I've never known so much offense caused to so many by so little. The British have opened too many gates and are about to lose their values. There should be a 'Secular Constitution' explaining precisely what British values are and it needs to be written down in STONE before things get out of hand; if they aren't already. The dubious doctrine of multi-culturalism is little more than a sticking plaster on the gaping wound of mass immigration thirty years ago that was never really thought through. It looks fabulous on glossy leaflets from the British Council about how modern we are in the UK but in practice it sucks.
What upsets me is that ordinary people in the UK who feel this way and who aren't necessarily very articulate or weasely with words try to say this but it just comes out sounding all racist; they are vilified by the chattering classes as mere 'Sun and Mail readers' which implies a room-temperature IQ and a Comprehensive education; but actually these people are naturally friendly and perhaps a little shy with it: they are just concerned at what they see is a lack of flexibility. A way to illustrate such inflexibility would the vegetarian who comes to my house and insists on a salad. I want to give it to her, as she is my friend and I don't want to upset her. Yet, I am never able to ask for a steak when I visit hers.. After a while, it starts to p*ss me off, but I don't know how to tell her, since it would make me sound 'not tolerant'.
I myself have been at middle class dinner parties in the Home Counties and expressed this sentiment and people look at me like I'm a white supremacist. I point out that I live in the Middle East and don't read the Sun, and that helps my hosts to open up a bit. (sometimes they will admit similar sentiments somewhat the way in rebels in a communist state recognise fellow conspirators - quietly and behind closed doors.)
To take this vegetarian example and put it into context, it would mean my friend the veggie will say "I made you your favourite sirloin. I don't know how you can touch that stuff, but enjoy it anyway". But, what are the chances of that?
should not have apologised.
This is how silly the UK has become because of the PC brigade.
It's not that long since that a similar group complained about the Black Museum that has existed for donkeys years in the police force.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/femail/article-1027300/How-I-driven-brink-ruin-refusing-hire-Muslim-hair-stylist-wouldnt-hair.html
More detail on the hairdressing case. Note the photographs do clearly show that the atmosphere and image of the salon is not in accord with a hairdresser who would wear conservative muslim dress and a hijab. other salons may be more appropiate, but not this one by the look of it.
"Deaths in the Bible. God - 2,270,365
not including the victims of Noah's flood, Sodom and Gomorrah, or the
many plagues, famines, fiery serpents, etc because no specific numbers
were given. Satan - 10."
The hairdresser story is an interesting legal issue. The lady in question applied for a job but did not get it, not because of her race or religion but on the grounds that it was an urban/trendy/dying studio and the owner wanted someone with that look. The lady claimed 36,000 pounds damages. The court found no case of discrimination to answer but bestowed damages of 4,000 pounds for HURT FEELINGS!!!
So every time I fail to secure a job I might try to claim for feeling a bit down about the situation.
"Deaths in the Bible. God - 2,270,365
not including the victims of Noah's flood, Sodom and Gomorrah, or the
many plagues, famines, fiery serpents, etc because no specific numbers
were given. Satan - 10."
Agreed.. I was thinking of a case last year when a council took away a foster child because a Christian couple refused to teach him about homosexuality.
I agree that the word 'uproar' seems to be a Mail device to ratchet things up, however the quotes suggest that some members of the community complained enough to take it up with a councillor and extract an apology from the police commissioner.
As for your second point I disagree. Not in the work place, he/she should keep those thoughts private otherwise it's carte blance to voice all our private gripes to, and about, our colleagues. If someone is against gays and vocalises this then they would not be suitable to work in a gay bar and should not claim discrimination and damages just because the situation is against their beliefs.
"Deaths in the Bible. God - 2,270,365
not including the victims of Noah's flood, Sodom and Gomorrah, or the
many plagues, famines, fiery serpents, etc because no specific numbers
were given. Satan - 10."
Both these articles are a bit melodramatic. The Daily Grail using the word "Uproar"..
Some moron must havecalledand omplained. I can't really see a majority of Muslims even bothering about this.
ASs far as the gay issue is concerned, I am a bit wary of it..I agree that hate actions should be discouraged and punished. However, if a Christian , Muslim, Jew or whatever is religious and says that he is against homosexuality, then he should have a right to do so.
What shyt! Seriously I think they just need to fcuk off! I dont understand why ur government tolerates such bullshyt
I dream of a better tomorrow where Chickens can cross the Road without having their motives questioned - Unknown