2000 flats kept vacant in Doha to support high rents

Not entirely sure why Qatar is sending people to Singapore to Learn surly that would mean hard work?

I honestly don't think the mind set is the same for Qataris versus people from Singapore, the Qataris don't really have to work because they have gotton used to all the free money being given out. If the Government stopped that here first there would be a riot and then people would have to work for a living until this happens and frankly I din't think it will this place will always feel third world.

It will take at least 10-15 years for them to adopt that system. if it works I don't know. but surely lot of hard work for Qatari professinals to stomach. Where you come from, who are you, rich or poor. they don't give a damn. but if you are dedicated, bright, can cotribute positivelyly. they welcome you with both hands. They only want the best. My humble opinion only.

Its been going on for an year now. Some of the government corporations are sending Qatari professionals in Medicine, finance, accounting & engineering to be integrated in an attachment program to benefit from the way things work there.

Do you think it will work? Or the beaurocratic mindset will kill it?

I lived there and moved here purely for the financial gains. UI am not reccomending anybody to live there. That place is sooooooo expensive to live. I agree there are lot of pros there but there are lots of cons there. Job market is 10 times better here. even though a company select you to work there ultimate say is with the government. They control everything. from your education stream to you future job. It is a carefully very well organized system there. They plan not for tomorrow 30 years ahead. That why they from zero to 1st worldd country within 30 years. thanks to the Father of the Nation Mr. Lee Kwan Yu. hemade it happened.Imagine a country without even drinking water (they import drinking water from malaysia and Indonesia) to a developed country. everybody worked extremly hard to be there today. If you happened to go there make sure you visit the Sentosa Island. There is a musuem that shows the Singapore Story. Rental are not controled. it is a free market. supply and demand. the more demand simply they build more. Ther are so many things. It is difficult to write everything here.

Quick question are you in Singapore now or have you lived there, if you left why and would you recommend living there.

There are possible jobs for me there should I decide to leave.

Many thanks

Oh and a point for the forum, if rents are high in Singapore I think they are justified its is after all voted the number one place to live in Asia, plus you have all the financial institutions there. Plus tonnes more jobs and now restrictions on Alcohol etc. And I have heard Eng Chong could maybe put me straight here that there are rent controlled apartments. Mmmmmm next stop Singapore ?

After all I have done my hard time here ha ha

Singapore is a 1st world country. If we feel that we are cramped just take the car and drive to malaysia and enjoy everything for the half of the price.leave after friday work and come back sunday night.Viola

Backwards Qatar, Dynamic Singapore.

I think their rents are justified, excellent roads and travel system. Loads of entertainment bars, clubs shops etc. Oh and the place is a tiny Island so space is a bit short. Plus it actually looks and feels like a rich country where as this place feels more third world.

Here................................errrrrrrr......Tax Free.......

Great.

Sin ming plaza. nice place although the surrounding are little bit crowded. near to old Turf Club right. Just go downstairs to kopitium and eat Bak Kut Teh with Teh Tarek. or an ice cold tiger.

"100 times better living

100 times better living conditions. but you have to pay Income Tax, GST,Road Tax, ERP,COE,you have to pay even you go to the public toilet Singapore is PAP. Pay and Pay. Here almost everything free."

----> Eng chong you bring back my old memories lol. Our condo in Singapore was in Upper Thomson Road (Sin Ming Plaza). 2 bedroom with swimming pool on the playground. We paid around SGD 1.500 (that was 6 yrs ago)

http://www.funnyordie.com/videos/74

100 times better living conditions. but you have to pay Income Tax, GST,Road Tax, ERP,COE,you have to pay even you go to the public toilet Singapore is PAP. Pay and Pay. Here almost everything free.

is less than QR 7000. What you can get that money here is some crappy flat.

Singapore have more to offer than Qatar dont you think?

2,800 dollars for a unit in Bayshore park is very reasonable. Lived there before. You don't have anything like that here to compare.

This is from the Peninnsula: http://www.thepeninsulaqatar.com/features/featuredetail.asp?file=julyfeatures172007.xml

Malaysian financial executive Ron Tan wasted no time in renewing his lease for a three-bedroom apartment in Singapore when his landlord decided to raise the monthly rent by 300 Singapore dollars (199 US).

“I see no point in haggling. The way the market is right now, I think my landlord is very reasonable,” said Tan, who counts himself among the lucky few to escape the pain of a red hot property market.

Other foreign executives have no such luck as they find themselves hit with rents that have increased by as much as 50 per cent, or more, amid a property boom in the city-state.

At the Bayshore Park condominium, popular with foreigners because of its closeness to the beach, monthly rents for a two-bedroom unit have doubled to 2,800 dollars from a year ago.

“The owners are getting greedy. It’s really a landlord’s market right now,” said a property agent who wanted to be identified only as May.

Well guyz, better take Singapore off that list of future countries to consider :)

PS: Ur bound to get greedy landlords in ANY country with potential economic growth, so sit back relax and survive, uh i mean, enjoy the weather. :P

I totally agree with you in the beaurocracy.

nothing Is changing Unfortunately

Terramax – couldn’t agree more, although maybe ten years is a bit tight.

In the shorter term though, whoever needs (and profit from) cheap energy to operate might still want to invest here I’m afraid …

Well if you beleive in peak oil maybe, its not gonna go to zero but Qatar and Saudi have done very well recently out of the Iraq war and the resulting 75 dollar oil prices.

The long term prospects of this country can only be ranked as middling to poor, its too backwards, too beuruacratic and is unlikely to progrss much further than it already has.

Things like the current rent situation will see to that, add in the way all labour is treated from teaboys to managing directors, unless things change fast people will wise up and ship out, I give it 10-15 years before Qatar and Dubai self implode and become irrlevent as china moves into the acendancy. We shall see, lets hope I make a profit on my flat before then.

I can tell you what will happen. As the world moves towards biological and renewable fuels (solar etc.) in the next 10 years the price of oil will fall below zero. And Qatar will end up where it started, in poverty and obscurity.

I believe Jesus threw the money lenders from the church if I remember, I think the fact that this is a Muslim country is certainly not the cause of the greed but it rather makes the whole thing even less palatable, after all if you are going to run a country based on Islamic principles shouldn't you try and live by them too.

I've mentioned the hypocrisies of it before and it does annoy me.

I just hope that I can get in and out of the market here make some money and get out.

Who knows what will happen though ?

Well said Aviduser.

As homeowners ourselves abroad, there is is no financial gain to be made by keeping a unit empty. It is the sheer greediness of the landlords here, who rent badly built homes at huge prices.

I know that we would rather rent ours to someone trustworthy for less money, knowing that one day the place will be fully paid and in decent order. Here they just care about the money. It's funny but doesn't religion (any religion for that matter) refer to 'greed' as a sin?

"The greatness of a nation and its moral progress can be judged by the way its animals are treated." Mahatma Gandhi

And I have brought here but I am not blind to the stupidity going on here. I am worried for the long term, medium term they will keep on building until someone realises, tells them that people really don't want to do business in a desert with all the bureaucracy that goes with it when the world is leaning towards China, and Singapore, Hong Kong and numerous Chinese cities are advancing, have advanced further with out any of the sh!te that comes with this country.

People will relocate but I bet you Qatar is well below Singapore, China or pretty much anywhere else on people's wish list.

Its worrying me a bit, still I like it here so that helps. Interesting times ahead I think but perhaps not with a positive long term outlook.

3 BR F/F Flat in Singapore is QR 4000 compared to F/F 2 BR flat in Doha for QR 7500

When you invest you want to get the maximum rewards either hook or by crook. simple logic. By the way I saw one ad 2 or 3 days ago. selling property at a different location. strat at 650K.

Terramax your comments above are spot on about the size and type of properties being constructed. A 5 bed villa is excessive for a Couple and or or two children. And you are right about location too, there is a flurry of activity in my area with apartments being built right left and center, Ok its central but the streets they are being built on are no more than side streets. Not exactly up market locations.

Big companies can take some blame, after all its the Asian games that really drove us to the present situation. I think the landlords seeing what people were prepared to pay before the games now think that is normal. Of course most of the cost of the Apartments and Villas was borne by DAGOC so no one complained, now without DAGOC (Government) money floating around no one is prepared to pay the silly money.

So it is greed and stupidity two things many people have here in spades.

Also I was recently told that similar to above about bank loans, basically it goes like this,

You get a bank loan to build a compound/apartment block. Then if you rent the Whole thing to one company you get a massive cheque and the bank will then loan you more money to build another compound. The catch is ONE company has to rent so the bank loan is effectively guaranteed by the company renting the Villas/apartments. hence you see so many adverts with compounds available to one company only.

This explains why so much is empty its the rather precarious way everything is financed. If the bank was less willing to lend money on this basis things would be different.

Now how many companies are going to want to pay the stupid rates wanted, well it would seem less and less.

And here in lies Qatar's problem, lets face it its not the cultural capitol of the World and would any of us really be here if it wasn't for the Tax free money, of course not. Now imagine you are a multinational company, looking for a base in the region. Tax free incomes are a great incentive for staff but they want to keep the costs low. Then they see the rents/bureaucracy and think actually to run an office here is going to be more expensive and more hassle than the tax free status brings us benefits. Lets just move to Singapore. Same goes for Dubai, too big and too busy why deal with an Arab country when East Asia is so easy to do business with.

If the Country doesn't wise up in 10 years time both here and Dubai could be enormously expensive white Elephants.

And when rents are lower in Singapore than here and Dubai you know you have a problem. The bubble will burst when all the construction is finished and everyone says "now what ?"

Just read that article on qatarjournal-quite sad, the attitude-yes i admit that its fair enough these guys are tryin to recover their capital outlay,but is it reason enough to not lower the rent at the cost of ppl waiting for accomodation?

Excuse me? A mortgage on WHAT property? Pearl? ZigZag towers? There are NO ready properties available.

Welcome to Doha where the gap between the "have's" and the "have not's" is clear to all. Yes it's expensive but anyone coming to a country with the growth rate of Qatar surely understands why. deal with it or leave, simple. Us westerners can't change a thing, all we can do is make the best of the situation. Stop complaining, get a mortgage and make some money too. Your not changing the world by complaining every week about the same topics. We know its a property owners market in Doha, so buy something.

Dear SeArChEr. Qatar Government and Qatar landlords are the same people. Think about it.

Yes Novita, Terramax is right.

The grace period is not unlimited.

If you're looking for a problem, you're probably gonna find one.

villas and houses vacant rather than renting them in low prices. That is true because like my friends here said before, these landlords have no idea about the market needs or any marketing or even planning skills. They are so greedy and want to get the money that they paid for the construction of those buildings and the other costs in one year.

This is impossible and the issue they don't want that money so fast to keep it in the banks or paying for the loans, they want it to build more houses and villas that they can rent and get more and more money. It is like going into a minus loop, would never be broken if you did not apply some conditions to break it. Otherwise the wheel would continue to go and crash everything it finds in it's way.

My news say, Qatar Airways is one of the companies if it was not the biggest one in creating such a trouble. The new airport construction got like 16 new companies from outside working on it. The number of these people is around 20,000 and the project won't finish in one month so they will bring their families later. That would increase the number at least to the double, so as you can see here there are a lot of factors that is creating the problem.

1- Greedy Landlords thinking of how to add more money to the banks accounts.

2- Big Companies taking accommodation for their employees.

3- Landlords renting the whole compound to one company only.

4- Removing big compounds and demolishing complete areas for nothing but to have parks and such things.

5- No laws to regulate this matter or actions to be taken against the Renting Mafia Team to stop them or break this circle of unpleasant events.

6- Poor people who got no option but to accept the raise.

7- Short term contracts that ends after a year, starting the rent with 6000, after the contract ends here is the new contract 10,000 if you don't like it just leave.

8- Building materials costs are getting high and higher.

9- Bad planning was always there and would be for a good time also.

10- The cost of life here is getting higher and they think that accommodation should be part of it, but it really went so far away and break all the roles. Simply it is craziness.

There are other factors that I was trying to remember or post, but it is almost lunch time ... guess that is why my mind freezes all of a sudden :D

Novita it is only a) in islamic bank (you too can have a loan in islamic bank) and b) there is a limit on time that bank gives a qatari landlord to rent apartments.

i heard from a friend who work in a bank that the local qatari dont have to pay their loan till the property they built get rent out. So the landlord will loose nothing by not renting it out.

You need to learn basic economics.

It is not worth keeping the flats vacant. Better rent them at a bit lower than market prices/pay off the bank loan/ start making proft/buy more land and make more buildings

Looks as if the greed has taken over his senses

Should Qatar Govt really wants to help, start charging the Landlord for late payment even if the units are not rented out. Sue them bankrupt for non-payment.

Then you'll see a sharp decrease in rental & more accomodating Landlord.

six months ago, i found a landlord that cleverly designed a villa that had 3 floors and each floor could be converted to a seperate unit. the ground floor was basically mens sitting, womens sitting, dining, kitchen and 1 1/2 bathrooms (which converts to a 2bdr flat for qr.5,500.

first floor, 4 large room with attached bathrooms and kitchen(but very small(apparently he would gut them out and make them stores, once he moved in...) - 3 bdr for qr.6000.

third floor, similar... smaller rooms, so he fit in one more room... with a beautiful terrace - 4 bdr for qr.6500.

not only did he get qr.19k for a qr.15k, but once its paid off, he has a beautiful property to move in...

but then again.. thats just one guy...

All I Can Say Is: Welcome To Doha !!!

Friends, The Government Has A Hand In This Too.

Anything What We Can Do?

Yup.

Either Form A Group To Talk For The Expatriates or GET OUT OF THE COUNTRY...!!!

& Trust Me, This Is What A Local Told Me Too...!!!

It is not as simple as. First of all even if islamic banks allow landlords to wait until the properties are rented, the waiting time is not indefinite, and is usually limited by 6 to 8 months.

Second: most of the properties are not constructed using bank loans, remember 80% of the properties are in hands of 8-10 people.

Third: lots of empty properties, like villas are simply unrentable. While 5-6 bedroom villa is ok by arab standards (separate living areas for men and women, big families with lots of children), they are an overkill by western standards. Nobody in his sane mind will look for a 4-5 bedroom villa for a family of three. True, many expats live in such villas, but only if companies provide them with this type of accomodation, and even then half of the house will stay locked.

So what's the reason in constructing a palace, investing huge sums of money and then not being able to rent it out? Landlords simply don't have a clue on market requirements, and they are: 2-3 bedroom villas and apartments.

Fourth issue is the quality of workmanship. Brand new houses and apartments are poorly constructed, with uneven walls, breaking pipes etc. I understand that to build them cheaply they export unskilled labour from India, Nepal etc. And these people work as good as they can, but since neither workers were properly trained, nor they countrymen engineers haven't seen anything better, the outcome is miserable. Of course they build it to the best standards known to them, but these standards are extremely low.

There are exceptions, but you have to pay dearly to live in a decent place.

000... he should realize the problems first, then the location how much he can earn from those flats. For ex: he constructed some flates in Industrial area and looking for same rents in Corniche ...its a huge blunder.

I hope he don't have any knowldege of business, some dirty hands behind him to put him trouble..

[img_assist|nid=24194|title=A Good Face|desc=::oo:: A good face is a letter of recommendation ::o::|link=none|align=left|width=180|height=180]

Now, if you were a landlord who had invested huge amount of money hoping for a (high) return and you don't get any because nobody wants your damned expensive flats/villas what do you do?

A. Wait for as long as needed (who knows, maybe even forever) to find somebody who will give in and pay what you are asking for;

B. Keep increasing the price every 3-6 months since time is passing by and you do need to get your (high) return in the end one way or another;

C. Lower the rent so to actually start making some return on investment, after all something is better than nothing;

A, B or C?

I don't know … in my opinion this is just another way to manipulate the market. Leave places empty so that the demand is still (artificially) higher than the offer and prices don't need to fall; then you can rent your other (worthless) places at an indecent price.

Apartments were built taking 100% loans from the bank . they do not have to pay installments until the units are rented. They have the luxury of not paying until they rent out the unit on their terms. This is the reason.

dinkyw,...you are correct the concerned authorities should take action on these matters...and we have already discussed these matters here as well...

[img_assist|nid=24194|title=A Good Face|desc=::oo:: A good face is a letter of recommendation ::o::|link=none|align=left|width=180|height=180]

Has anyone else noticed that a 2 bedroom 3 months ago was 6k and is now 8k? It is not only the greedy landlords, but the Real Estate Agents as well. It is these people creating slums, with so many people sharing rooms, and not enough bathrooms!

I have an attitude and I know how to use it!

so they would rather have no money than less money!!!!????

Wh@t wE see....... dePeNds m@inly 0n wHaT wE l0ok foR....

ngourlay...really they are the greedy people...

[img_assist|nid=24194|title=A Good Face|desc=::oo:: A good face is a letter of recommendation ::o::|link=none|align=left|width=180|height=180]