Property Developers: Killing The Golden Goose
For around 2 years now, many of us have been hearing of the benefits of buying property off-plan, where substantial savings could be made. It's been happening in Dubai for quite a few years now, and the market seemed to have settled into a fairly predictable pattern of attainable profits from buying and selling off-plan properties. The idea is fairly simple: the developer covers his building costs and profit early on from selling off-plan properties, and the independent investor (you and I, if we are brave enough to take the plunge) gets a property which is worth anything from 15% to 50% more than you paid for it when it is finally ready to move in to. Remember that you only pay 10% or 20% as a deposit, but you gain 100% of any rise in the value of the property - provided you can also sell off plan and only have to pay a small percentage to the financier, you've got it made.
Now comes the crunch: a couple of days ago, I was invited to a pre-launch by Damac Properties, which I couldn't attend. One of my acquaintances did go, as he had made a substantial (on paper) profit on a property that he had invested in with Damac. At the time that he bought (December 2007), one-bedroom apartments were being sold by Damac at around QAR 980,000. The same properties are now being touted on the market for around 1,700,000 which, considering my acquaintance paid only 10% deposit, should guarantee a huge return.
You can imagine that he was very keen to see what was on offer this time around. Imagine his surprise, then, when the pre-launch off-plan price of a one bedroom apartment was announced as QAR 2,000,000! It looks like this particular property developer wants not only his building cost and profit up front, he also wants the investor's profit as well!
I was discussing this with a friend in Dubai, who tells me that the same thing is happening there, and the developers make no secret that they want the lion's share of profits from these developments. There is obviously no way that the build costs have doubled in 6 months, so it looks like at least one developer is hell bent on killing the goose that lays the golden eggs. I for one will be shopping around very carefully before I commit to any other off-plan property investments in Doha or Dubai.
A final note: I posted this in "Cost of Living" as it seemed to be the closest forum to the subject matter. Apologies if I got that wrong.
Only a fool would come o Doha to compete/watch Olympics. It would take an even bigger fool to grant them the Olympics in the first place.
They'd be better suited to host Camelympics!
the goose is dead, now they rely on the jaguars..:))
keep watching, these are yet the very good days....
everyone is experiencing the impact of this. if you actually go to the back to the basics, back to fundamental economy, more supply means less demands. obviously there are more residential units being developed today here in qatar (probably because they where expecting the olympics for 2016).this translates to more supply. so demands will be less. common sense says prices should go down. but whats happening? prices are still increasing! BIG time!
anyone care to explain this?
HK$7M = Permanent Residency
If you're living life on the edge, you've got too much room.
Canda is the most immigrant friendly country. Anyways the cold is much more bearable than the 50C heat here and the humidity
but investment means establishing business and u have to give jobs to canadian citizens. I do not think that buying a house qualifies for that. Plus you will get a greencard first, not the citizenship, you have to go there and live there to get the citizenship. And I do not think you can find mortgage... Good Luck there with the cold weather and 50% income taxes....
you get landed immigrant status.
knoxcollege, do u mean citizenship or landed immigrant status?
If you invest $500,000 in Canada they automatically grant you citizenship.
You should consult an immigration lawyer, he will tell you the rest of the details.
i have never heard such a thing that when u buy a house in canada they give u citizenship. can u post the link?
will u be able to get a mortgage?
in developed markets you can only expect around 5% rental return, so $2500 for a $500000 house is ok, but you will pay tax, insurance and maintanence. in this crazy region rental returns range btw 10-14%!... there is a bubble in the rental market for sure, it will burst in dubai first though...
I am thinking of buying a detached house in Canada for $500,000 and renting it out. From rent monthly I can easily get $2500. Plus I will also get the canadien citizenship.
As for Qatar I dont want to gamble my hard earned money.
Is anyone thinking of buying at the Zig Zag? I actually want to sell mine. Please PM if you are Interested.
Hey, thanks for letting us know. Your post is so valuable especially to those who are planning to invest in real estate over there.
"To be yourself in a world that is constantly trying to make you something else is the greatest accomplishment. "
Ralph Waldo Emerson
hye ,
What are the average internal floor sizes of a 1/2/3/bed aprtment in pearl qatar?
regards
coolguy797
@Hamoudi, you must not be very intelligent. I'm sorry for saying that but
1) Qatar's business model is not at all like Dubai
2) Qatar's resources are not the same as Dubai's
and
3) Qatar is too small? It's bigger than Dubai!
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do keep us posted doha steve and best of luck !!!!!
its always there....hehehe...
"if you don't like the heat... get out of the kitchen... but stop trying to fan the flames before you leave... it will burn you on the a** as you go through the doorway...." ME
visit www.qatarpets.org
.... I particularly like the "fan the flames" comment.
I'll raise my (non-alcoholic) glass to those with the vision and guts to go for it and take a chance.
Lamea makes some good points too ...... to stay or not to stay [in the Doha property market]
I'll post on QL when [if] I get my apartments sold and have the final figure for how much of the profits I will actually get to keep. If it's worth it, then I might just have another go.
thanks kelly.
property was an investment, and thats exactly what DohaSteve was refering to....
Canary, the idea of buying and selling properties isn't foreign... its a sound investment opportunity. Some people just don't see it like that and they would rather buy from the 1st time buyer than be a 1st time buyer themselves and be the one to make the profit.
I am looking into becoming a investment buyer... I am not buyer to live in it myself, but to sell it for a profit later... thats what its all about.
We cannot help it if others didn't take the same opportunity when it was presented to them....
"if you don't like the heat... get out of the kitchen... but stop trying to fan the flames before you leave... it will burn you on the a** as you go through the doorway...." ME
visit www.qatarpets.org
Damac did cancel the palm springs project and now they declared they will continue it: http://www.arabianbusiness.com/516821-damac-will-continue-palm-springs-project-says-chairman?ln=en
Deyaar has the corruption problem: http://www.arabianbusiness.com/517077-dubais-deyaar-releases-q1-says-2-directors-resign
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the real sharks here are the banks!!! have u seen the clauses in their mortgage contracts. they really bleed u dry. with the 1.5% or 2.5 % taken by the developer(on resale of the property) and the 1% minimum early settlement fee the banks demand in addition to the compound interest the cream of the profits are devoured by them , whats left isnt worth the effort!!!
kelly shores coul u send thelink to that news article
we were at their launch party and yes shocked at the new prices but damac is not the only one even though they are the most costly. like i said on another thread sabban towers have increased their price in a month. we were offered a two bed apt for 1.95mil and at present it is worth 2.2mil!!! sounds good to the investor and any prospective investors doesnt it?
the major problem with dubai is the hype. dozens of buildings are lying vacant with no tenants to fill them in, so unless u actually want to live in them dont buy them. poor investment.
here in qatar, after three years , the energy city and other projects will be ready and then that area and its flats will be hot cakes.the situation is just the same as it was in dubai whe its market was in its infancy. marina and nearby areas were deserted and too far from civilisation.
QATAR WOULD ALWAYS BE AT VERY HIGH RISK IN INVESTING...THEY HAVE BEEN TRYIN TO COPY LIKE DUBAI...WHICH SEEMS IMPOSSIBLE SINCE ITS VERY SMALL COUNTRY....
YEP FOR DEFO THEY GOT IT LIKE DUBAI....ONLY TRAFFIC AND FEW BUILDINGS...LOL THATS ALLL
CHERS
IVE BEEN BLESSED 4 HAVIN U IN MY LYF, IF I HAD THE CHANCE I WUDN'T HESITATE 2 MAKE U MY WIFE.
did you read the news about Damac's projects cancellations in Dubai and the corruption by some of the company's senior staff
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@Doha, all property is a gamble, and the higher the risk, the higher the reward (usually)
Qatar has alot of great investments, Damac's Garden Heights and the other one just aren't worth it.
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How many other people in QL are advertising an apartment for exactly the amount that you mentioned? Here's an interesting little snippet: people who assume the worst of others without bothering to find out anything about them are generally projecting their own personality falws on to those around them. How does that shoe fit?
lol they have a stand in villagio and selling apt.s from zigzag tower...
If the shoe fits then...... I did not mention any names.
I think the word "conned" is pretty harsh, as you don't even know me. And as for the "fast penny", I have had these apartments for over a year, so your definition of fast must be different from mine.
Yes, I am trying to sell both my apartments in Doha, but not in this forum - that's what the Classified section is for. Also, as Richard so rightly points out, you don't know what anything is worth until someone actually makes you an offer for it. So far, I have tried 4 agents to sell these apartments, and the only ones who have actually stated that they will advertise the properties in a newspaper, or have any kind of focused selling plan, are the ones I appointed yesterday. Of course, that won't stop me from trying to sell them wherever I can. Normally, the developers (who want 1.5% as a fee for getting you a buyer) do nothing more than place the property on their resell list.
This didn't start out as a tool for me to sell my apartments, and I am certainly not touting for buyers here. I was shocked when I heard what was happening with Damac, and I wanted to share my views with other members; it looks like there are a few people who feel the same way as I do. I had intended investing with Damac on the Lusail development before their latest price rise. I have made the decision now to invest in Dubai or Abu Dhabi (but not with Damac) where the potential return is definitely lower, but at least they have a stable and established secondary market.
Qatar is just too much of a gamble, especially when the developers have turned into sharks.
Final point: ratso says nobody is here for the beauty of Qatar, and I absolutely agree. I for one am here because it gives me the chance to give my family a better quality of life than they could get in the UK, and it also gives me the potential to stop working sooner than my peers and contemporaries back home.
Please don't let yourself be conned by anyone who is in the property market and wheeling and dealing and still trying to sell an appartment in one of the new towers for 2.8 mil. which is still under devlopment don't ask how much the original price was.
People please take care there are many people on the market looking for a fast penny.
You are right in everything you say. The point is that the profits are paper profits and you really have no idea of what the real value is until you try to sell. I bought a 2 bedroom apartment in the zigzag tower nearly a year ago.
Apparently, all the apartments are sold and the value has doubled. Funny thing about that is, if you call the developer and ask if they can find you an apartment in the zigzag towers, they always can. So much for being sold out!
Also, as there is no developed secondary market here, it is impossible to have any real idea of the value of your property.
Just call me Tigasin. That's what I'm talking about
qatexpat dust storm has nothing to do with it. nobody is here for the beauty of qatar, everybody is here to get their share from qatar's vast natural resources. as long as there is money and opportunity people will continue to come and live here...
I was also there and shocked to see 2000qr/ft2. A decent 1br will cost u around 2,000,000 as steve says. When they were selling 1br for 900,000 in piazza, I thought that it was too much as u could buy a 1br in dubai-marina with that price, which is already developed, and it is dubai that is 10 times more interesting place than doha.
Well, I beleive that rents are too expensive here. Because owners are expecting 10-14% annual return, this is ridiculous and it is not like this anywhere in the world. It is usually around 5%.
However I found the prices of apartments normal, considering the fact that a 1br in NYC costs around 3,500,000QR.
The problem with qatar is there is not much development. Not at all comparable with Dubai. If u wanna see what I meen buy a newspaper on Friday in Dubai and Qatar and compare the number of ads for developments.
They try to sell property that is overpriced that is then up to the public to realize this is not London or NY and the price is ridiculous, if no one buys they have to come down. Unfortunately building costs are double to what they were even 2 years ago, but they still are well overpriced not even knowing what your final product will be.
@steve, I was there, when the prices were announced half of the people got up and left.
Damac has over priced their latest tower in Lusail
However I've seen the master plan and there'll be ALOT of other towers. Damac is just trying to milk it at the moment. Damac is a Dubai based company, so if they're doing it in Dubai, you definately know they'll be doing it in Doha.
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Click here for LOADS of Qatar info I♥Q <-- (Expat and Local Info)
Totally agree with you...
The launch price seems heavily inflated and we know that its got nothing to do with the actual appreciation in building cost.
Anyway, good luck to the investors !
On a side note : When Doha had the most recent duststorm last Friday, it made me think, even in the Pearl, they will have to undergo the effects of the dust storm. Why would anyone choose to live there or retire there ? Aren't there nicer places around the world for international investors ?
Quite interesting stuff DohaSteve. I never expected that property developers in the area would be so greedy.